It's time to Ask Konami about Suikoden 6

[Vextor]

It's always good to have various different methods working at the same time in any type of activism. I recall a similar situation back when I was an environmental activist. There were always some disagreements between those who do extreme things, such as send hate mail to corporate CEOs, spray graffiti, organize protests etc... and those who prefered a more "compassionate" approach by having dialogue with people who disagreed, doing outreach with church groups, having educational seminars, etc.

However, an experienced activist once told me it's important to have these separate ways of tacking the same problem. That way there's a better chance the activism can reach a wider audience. It's also good to have an "annoying, prickly" activist population so the more "compassionate, apologetic" activist population can come in and make concessions with the target.

Thus, I don't really see any problem with one group mass mailing executives and annoying the heck out of them, while another group tries to sooth the relations. However, it will probably work better if these people with different approaches act independently from each other.

[Hirathien]

Some people get seriously worked up over this. If someone has a negative input, it's his right to have that negative input. So far everyone has pitched in and tried to help their own way, but right now it looks like there's a group of people being the PETA of Suikoden, and they seem to think if we aren't part of the Solution, we're part of the problem.

Chill out, we're all on this site to enjoy Suikoden. You might disagree, you might agree, but Suikoden is what brought us all together.

Just keep it civil guys, and hope for the best.

[gilgamesh31]

I have no issue with people posting different views but could they atleast back them up other then crying about us "pissing off Konami" and "theyve got bigger fish to fry" who cares? we as fans have the right to ask if Suikoden is dead or not. Its like we are being made out to be these horribly abusive fans because weve being ignored until now for what six years? (I'm sorry but i really cant count Tierkries)...

[Raww Le Klueze]

the PETA of Suikoden

How many PETA members does it take to change a lightbulb?

None, PETA can't change anything.

[son_michael]

@KC_MCDOHL

In response to your pm, my opinion on this thread is as such. I think its a great idea for the Suikoden fanbase to make themselves known. I wouldn't put too much stock in Konami's facebook page but the message might reach a few people. I would suggest trying to contact the main departments that this would directly affect but do it in intervals of a few months, this way it appears that you are not harassing them. I completely agree that the best request we can make is to ask Konami to re release Suikoden 1 and 2 but it needs to be on the 3DS(doesn't have to be in 3d). The entire world is going to once again love Nintendo when the 3DS is released, if Suikoden makes it onto that platform it will receive world wide attention and even more fans will be created then the ones that spawned from the PS1 days. With the right marketing and attention Suikoden could become just as big as dragonquest, its up to Suikoden fans to make Konami believe that. So try to control your passion, become the strategist and gather your SOD(the fans) and when you have a big enough army take action again, just don't constantly spam the same thing over and over because that will accomplish nothing. Keep looking for new ways to get your message across, the best ways are the ones that attract hundreds or thousands of supporters(like youtube videos etc). If Konami gets the impression that its not just a few hundred fans that want Suikoden back, they may decide to support Suikoden again.


In all honesty, its a hard road to traverse and I can't walk it with you as I have a very busy college life(im 26) and I don't even have a facebook or twitter account. I wish you luck and pray that Suikoden will be revived in all its glory, I will eagerly check this thread for updates on your great campaign, should you decide to go down that road.

[Jowy Atreides]

As Vextor said, parallel campaigns working towards the same goal should agree to disagree on their methods and focus on developing and implementing their respective strategies to make their goals reality. Maybe two separate topics -- one for the "calm" activists and another for the "aggressive" activists -- should be created.

[FinalLegion]

I have no issue with people posting different views but could they atleast back them up other then crying about us "pissing off Konami" and "theyve got bigger fish to fry" who cares? we as fans have the right to ask if Suikoden is dead or not. Its like we are being made out to be these horribly abusive fans because weve being ignored until now for what six years? (I'm sorry but i really cant count Tierkries)...

Since you can't seem to keep quiet about me, I'll tell you exactly why I'm doing this.

I love the Suikoden series. It's one of my favorite series; in fact, it's pretty damn close to being my absolute favorite series. I most sincerely want to see the continuation of this series. S1-S5 has created so many different directions that the series could go in that I feel it would be waste if some of those avenues were never explored. There is a plethora of story material to draw from and the the particular things that make Suikoden unique lend themselves to good storytelling. It is with high hopes that Konami takes advantage of these particulars and moves forward with the development with S6.

And it's exactly to see that hope fulfilled that I don't need whiners and cry-babies like you potentially screwing things up.

It's high time that you and those like you got over taking this all so personally. You have the nerve to say Konami is ignoring you? You think it's within your province to make demands of Konami?

Who the hell told you that Konami is supposed to be working on YOUR timetable? The only interest you have in this company is playing their games. The people that work for Konami have a damn lot more at stake than that. All you're concerned with is the satisfaction of your own petty wants. News bulletin: Konami was not established to cater to just you...or any one fanbase for that matter.

As to "backing up" my claims, let me tell you that every claim I've made is absolutely valid. Konami DOES have bigger fish to fry right now. They've got a lot more on their plate than worrying about a series, that while unique, cannot honestly be said to be one of their flagship series. As much as we all love this series, facts are facts: it's been a second tier series for Konami with a rather limited fanbase. Now, I don't think that's going to stop Konami from continuing this series. In fact, I'm rather hopeful that there are those within Konami who are advancing the idea stages of S6 as we speak. I have no proof, of course...it's just a feeling.

Regardless, Konami works THEIR pace...not yours, mine or a fanbase's pace. This constant wave after wave of letter writings, posts, Tweets...whatever...directed at Konami needs to be over. They KNOW. They are aware. I'm sure that they are very pleased that Suikoden has such devoted fans...but a repetitious assault, no matter how nice or PC it may be, is not going to get Konami to tune in more than they have. Eventually, it's just going to get them to tune out...or worse, it will propel them into hurriedly releasing an S6 whose only goal is to soak up as much profit as possible from a rabid fanbase...an S6 that would, at best, be average, at worst, be a disaster.

The ball is now firmly in Konami's court. Let them play it.

[FinalLegion]

FinalLegion, I understand your frustration, but you have clearly missed the points of many things I have said. I am not going to repeat myself, again. Please re-read all the entries made since your first post.

No, KC...I haven't missed your points. You, however, are missing the point. You and others have, somewhat constructively, created contact between this community and Konami. The contact has been positive and reception to the message has been positive. That's good. We're grateful. It's mission accomplished.

Konami knows...Konami is aware...and STILL you won't let up. That's like telling your favorite director how much you love a film series he's done and hope that he'll work towards continuing it and him telling you that, while there are no current plans in place, he's grateful to see how much you appreciate the series and all the work that has been done. He's aware, he knows...you've told him what you felt you need to tell him.

Then you tell him again.
And again.
And again.
And one more time.
And then another time for good measure.

How long do you think it's going to be before he either ceases contact with you altogether or just has some low rank assistant send you what amounts to a "thank you for you interest" form letter? That's what you're getting from Konami...just a standardized, PC 'thank you' letter. I would have thought you'd figured that out by now. You're just being placated, man. It's their way of telling you 'yes, we get it. We really do.' Keep it up and I'm certain that sooner or later they are going to be insulted. You'll have them saying "geez does this guy think we don't get it? WTF?". That leaves a bad taste. There's a law in retail...it's said-and believe me, after working 20 years in retail and corporate planning I;ve heard it said a LOT-that if you give one customer bad service, they'll likely tell 10 people who are likely to tell at least 5-10 others who...well, you get the idea. The point is you end up with more people than you want thinking poorly about your operation.

Well, it also works in reverse. When a customer-or customers-continue to bombard a company with a 'we like, we want' attitude...no matter how nicely or well thought out it is, it works against you because pretty soon someone takes a negative view of you. That view spreads. That's the last thing our community needs. Oh, no company would ever admit this publicly...but I've been there and I can tell you that's what happens.

Time to let Konami be as Konami wants to be. No one is saying that these campaigns cannot be picked up again in the future; heck, it may be necessary...but for now, it's enough.

[gilgamesh31]

Time to let Konami be as Konami wants to be. No one is saying that these campaigns cannot be picked up again in the future; heck, it may be necessary...but for now, it's enough.

Oh so now we are working on your timetable are we? Seriously for someone who's posts are such long posts you simple rehash the same points youve already made "again and again and then another time for good measure" "Dont spoil the series for me" is all im hearing from this crybaby.

Look Konami havent exactly been smart with suikoden have they? Suikoden 3 never being released in PAL regions. Three games never even made it outside Japan and then we have tierkries that was basically a **** YOU to suikoden fans. I can see how 20 years in retail would leave you demoralized but cant you just sit in a quite room by yourself with your fingers crossed and quit tryin to convince people out of getting an answer?

No ones still spamming on Konami america so i dont know what your crying about? I believe that Konami america has as much clue as we do. Its Japan that we need to concentrate on and im not demanding that they tell me a release date or to rush it. I simply want to know if the series is dead or not and after tierkreis yes i think that we are entitled to know. And also they get Suikoden 2 on PSN and make a wider fan base hell the first one isnt even on PSN europe! so lets just leave Konami at their own pace so they can continue to leave us in the deep end forever.

P.S Dont double post

[Hirathien]

You might think we are entitled to know, thing is though, we're not. We are entitled to know if it releases, or when they offiicialy drop it. It might already be dropped, just not announced yet. You might get positive responses for a while, then they'll announce the cancellation.

And I don't think FinalLegion ever said something about someone working on his timetable, so i'm not sure what you are getting at, Gilgamesh.
You say he's rehashing his points, all over again? How are your posts any different? Don't go throwing rocks in that house of glass.

[gilgamesh31]

Who the hell told you that Konami is supposed to be working on YOUR timetable? The only interest you have in this company is playing their games. The people that work for Konami have a damn lot more at stake than that. All you're concerned with is the satisfaction of your own petty wants. News bulletin: Konami was not established to cater to just you...or any one fanbase for that matter.

@Hirathien: FinalLegion is basically saying that in the future when its ok by him we can campaign as long as its on his time. And about what i'm entitled to: I'm entitled to send konami as many emails as i see fit, i may not be entitled to be answered then but i am entitled to the freedom to do as i please and no amount of "Calm" activists begging me to reconsider is going to change that.

@all the other haters: We could just argue this until the end of time, we obviously have opposing opinions on this and thats fine but to be honest we are not asking for your permission here. You may have dettered some potential campaigners but thats about it. And im having to rehash my points to recounter his rehashes but everything ive said has been true konami have been less the smart thus far with this series.

[KC_MCDOHL]

@Vextor

I think what you say, Vextor, is very true. Many different methods of approach are neccesary, in any campaign. I think we can even take positivity out of the differences on this thread. Thanks for the input.

@SonMichael

Thanks for your response. Yea, I have emailed many different Konami addresses but none of them have been continous or in a spamming nature. Like you advised, I also wait a while before I send my next emails, so as not to come across as a pest. I have been doing this since November 2010, and have only really now started to establish a small relationship with Konami and others. The only way in which I have maybe been a pest to Konami is with the whole Facebook thing. But, the way I see it, Konami Facebook is but a small, small portion of Konami, the negative effects of continously commenting on the Facebook page are very minimal. Anyway, that game is over now, we got a response, no need to continue.

I like your 3DS idea. This is indeed something Konami can captitalise on. Dont worry about bieng too busy to help, such is life for most of us.

@FinalLegion

I think we should start again mate. Many of our points are very similar, from what I can see, its just our way of percieving them, how we act upon them etc. So I'm not going to argue with you, or have a go at your opinions. Like Hirathein said, even if your opinion is (what someone else percieves as) negative, you are still entitled to post it. I still think you can put a positive message at the end of some kind of support, just so you dont come across as being in entire opposition to that person.

I don't know where your getting the idea that I am contoniously harrasing Konami with emails (apart from the Facebook campaign). I have simply messaged as many different email addresses as I could (and emailed them only once each) and the ones that have responded, I have tried to develop a relationship with. Aye, I admit, I am trying to get as many people as possible to do the same thing - because numbers is exactly what is needed for Konami to take any real notice. But how many people have actualy joined me on that, this far? From what I know, I can count on one hand. So therefore, there is no need for you to feel that I have continously harrased Konami ''Again. And again.
And again.
And one more time.
And then another time for good measure.''

As you said yourself, that kind of approach may even be necesary in the future. But I agree with you that it isn't needed at the moment. I am simply bieng very tactful and trying to build on a relationship which, beforehand, was no existent. There is nothing wrong in my approach to this, except perhaps the Facebook campaign. I can see how you think the Facebook campaign was wrong, even though I dont believe so (now that it has stopped, because Konami have responded), but the way in which I have emailed Konami in OTHER areas, there has been nothing wrong with it at all. If, however, many more people DO email Konami, like I have been asking, then I can understand why you would feel the way you do. I wont agree with it, completely, but I will atleast understand. But, as it stands at the moment, there has been none of the activity that you are getting so alarmed about, so I dont understand why you have taken this negative stance from the outset. But, this is just my opinion, I make no attempt to argue with you any further. Whenever I recieve a ''standarsized PC response'' from Konami, the relationship pretty much ends there. So, I do realise that. I only respond to emails that leave some hope for building some sort of relationship.
I think we got of on the wrong foot and your perception of how I am delaing with this situation is reasonably skewed.

Outside of what you know, I have done (what I feel is) some very positive activity for the Suikoden community - but have not had the chance, or even the INSENTIVE, to post it all on here because of the negativity already surrounding my efforts. We are 8 pages into this thread and are still talking about the ''Facebook Campaign'', which is really a very small contribution compared to what is possible. Would it make any difference to your opinion if I was to tell you that one of the Suikoden creators has seen and read the comments to Konami's response on Facebook and was quite pleased at our efforts?

Again. lets not argue any further, agree to disagree? As Hirathein said ''Suikoden is what brought us together''. All I am saying is that, apart from on Facebook, I have not been bombarding and abusing Konami with emails. I'll understand your difference in opinion if LOADS of other people asist me in emailing Konami. Although I hope they do, that is not the case at the moment. So, try and atleast be more positive even if you disagree, and please dont fire down something before it has even got off the ground. Maybe Jowy Artreides idea is to create two different topics a good one ?

[Raww Le Klueze]

I am simply bieng very tactful and trying to build on a relationship which, beforehand, was no existent.

Can't say that fits my experiences.

[Rooks]

Well, first off, I'd like to point out that comparing the Facebookers to PETA is a bit extreme. Spamming a public FB account with messages about the desire to see a new Suikoden is not equal to hiring a bunch of models to strip naked and cover themselves in fake blood while writhing in a faux agony in front of a fur and leather fashion boutique. On the other hand, I think it would be highly effective if we all chipped in and hired some models to dress up as Jeane and invade the KDE campus carrying signs saying things like: "You may want me, but I want Suikoden VI!" This might actually be our most effective means of . . . communication with Konami.

In lieu of that, then I have no problem with facebook as a means not only to communicate, but also to vent our frustration over the lack of news concerning the series. All of the spam and such that has occurred is the result of frustration. And while it is true that Konami does not exist as an entity to appease any particular fanbase, it is true that companies that ignore such mass movements take a tremendous risk in alienating their long-term, repeat customers. This is something that any sane business is aware of, and I can assert that I do not think Konami has quite descended to the level of General Motors, BP [Blossoming Plague], Bank of America, American International Group, or any of these other clearly insane companies. If indeed Konami has embraced the business models of these larger conglomerates, then Suikoden is already lost; even if they were to release a Suikoden VI, it would have none of the qualities we all love about the series.

However, I've pointed out in the past that businesses who's products are largely artistic are at least somewhat resistant to adopting certain business models that ignore the desires of the customer and the market entirely. So, I do not think it wrong to assert that Konami is -at least to an extent- influenced by consumer and market demand. The result of the facebook posts -though they be born from frustration- will be to demonstrate this market and consumer demand.

The assertions that 1. Konami does not listen to the fans, and thus the fanbase cannot influence their decisions, and 2. the facebook spamming can only harm the future of the series, is simply self-contradictory. While indeed Facebook spamming can annoy the IT employees tasked with operating Konami's network marketing, the idea that this "annoyance" would be passed onto anyone with influence over the future of the series is highly unlikely. In fact, this is far less likely than the possibility that these efforts will have a positive impact on the future of the series. So much so that I would say that being an annoyance to the English Network Marketing division could only serve to increase our chances of seeing a Suikoden VI.

Well, I could go on, but I doubt that no matter how much logic I use that I could actually change anyone's mind. This argument has become simply a battle of ideologies, and I don't think I need to say how fruitless these types of arguments can be.

[FinalLegion]

Time to let Konami be as Konami wants to be. No one is saying that these campaigns cannot be picked up again in the future; heck, it may be necessary...but for now, it's enough.

Oh so now we are working on your timetable are we? Seriously for someone who's posts are such long posts you simple rehash the same points youve already made "again and again and then another time for good measure" "Dont spoil the series for me" is all im hearing from this crybaby.

Look Konami havent exactly been smart with suikoden have they? Suikoden 3 never being released in PAL regions. Three games never even made it outside Japan and then we have tierkries that was basically a **** YOU to suikoden fans. I can see how 20 years in retail would leave you demoralized but cant you just sit in a quite room by yourself with your fingers crossed and quit tryin to convince people out of getting an answer?

No ones still spamming on Konami america so i dont know what your crying about? I believe that Konami america has as much clue as we do. Its Japan that we need to concentrate on and im not demanding that they tell me a release date or to rush it. I simply want to know if the series is dead or not and after tierkreis yes i think that we are entitled to know. And also they get Suikoden 2 on PSN and make a wider fan base hell the first one isnt even on PSN europe! so lets just leave Konami at their own pace so they can continue to leave us in the deep end forever.

P.S Dont double post

Where are you getting all this crap about what you think you are entitled to? Neither you nor myself nor anyone is entitled to having any of our demands met by Konami. Konami is NOT in the business to make you personally happy. They are in the gaming business and that means working towards having as a big a fanbase as possible happy.

You think that because you despised Tierkreis that you are entitled to some answer as to the future of Suikoden? Guess what....you're not. The only thing you are entitled to is to show your pleasure or displeasure for a product. Konami doesn't owe you an explanation for anything.

Seriously...you need to quit being such a whining, mewling pup and you need to start being more rational.