Lol. ne__ya, I actually took a crack at the Japanese version as well and was about to detail my findings.
Was stuck in the JPG ver since the walk through wall cheat doesn't seem to work but the door can be walked around LOL. I found out before your post (A reminiscence of the Matilda glitch, ah...).
I'll list out all my findings below for easier reading, as well as ideas, requests and next possible step if anyone willing to contribute. Its split since everyone interest in either the Rune, Sajah or the dungeon. Also some of request and theories.1)The Rune of Circulating Paths is there in the purple pedestal room. This I can 100% guarantee.
After using the JP version and got Japanese text I can read a bit. I know Chinese to tell some:
我 = I or me 新 = New
世界 = World 道 = Road or Path
百万 = million
少年 = Youngster or Young one
Fiddling with the choices correspond exactly to ne__ya script and will lead to 3 outcomes as it activate an event for you to walk to it:
-It will do something and crashes the game (This is what we're all hoping to see for the New Game+ but seems broken. Hope someone can fix it). But before it crashes it has a sound coming from it. My theory is that it play a music, then to an event that doesn't exist in the game file. It's just like any other event where the sound appears first before the game forces the player to walk around for the event.
- Somehow give you a chance to go out of the dungeon and warp you back to Sajah in a white screen (Will call it White Sajah). You can actually walk out to fix the issue but I don't know if there's any other changes after that. And no, the rock did not move
- Loop de loop. If you choose not to either it will force an event for you to walk back (previously it forces you to walk to it) and loop it again until you make one of the choices. Seems broken though.
Next step: Probably go through the music files and listen to see which music it plays before the crash to have an idea on where it leads to. It'll be quite hard since it plays like 0.1 sec before crashing. Or, even better, someone will fix the crash.
Theory: Everyone speculating on the New Game + with lots of hope.
My theory is that once you make the first decision before the crash, it plays music, then to an event that doesn't exist in the game file so it crashes. It's just like any other event where the sound appears first before the game forces the player to walk around for the event. So hopefully someone can get on that. 2)Sajah is the main entrance/spot for the dungeon. This I can 80% guarantee.
I say 80% because of the white screen but Its a safe bet to say 100%. After being warped to Sajah (whichever way) you will get a white screen. However you can still walk around and interact and even go out to the world map. Estimate warp location is the conspicuous rock near the girl. So its a safe bet that's where the dungeon is. If you use the walk through cheat (using the ENG version), the rock interact differently than the surrounding.
I put 80 % sure because if someone can get the white screen fixed then we can tell how it looks like.
Other fun tidbits:
There's a outlandish ornament that looks suspiciously like the two headed snake in the appraisal shop. Which could be a hint.
Sajah or Saja means calm or serene in Arabic. Could also mean enlightenment. Given the usage of real life language and places in Suikoden this seems a likely coincidence.
One weird thing did happen in the JPG version when I tried to collect orb, go back out, go back in to collect the orb again. In it, I went to the unknown dungeon, randomly got a orb, go through the Rune talk and warp back to White Sajah, got out and go back in--Somehow I appear near the trees beyond the boundary. Managed to get out, went around to warp back into the same UNKNOWN dungeon previously but all I got was a dark screen (No crash but the screen normally that shows its still loading the place). There's some sound there, but no music, and you can't access the menu so it was softblocked. No idea on the ENG ver though.
Next step: Probably walk around after the white Sajah and see if anything change. Seems unlikely since all the script and secrets has been found out already.
Theory: The dungeon in Sajah might not be a cave at all, seeing you just warp out to there and no indication there's a cave. Probably just a floor to warp to the dungeon while still remaining at Sajah.3)The dungeon...its a bit weird.
It doesn't really seems like a dungeon, more like a tower. If you advance through to the Pedestal you'll ultimately be reaching up.There are some same floors that has the same going down but just slightly at the side so you can assess them easily making the whole place confusing to explore. There are also the crashes that frustrate it more but will elaborate further.
Pyriel, does the code really say dungeon?
Also I notice the code skipped 09-12. Is that a coincidence?
09 - 11: Unknown Dungeon
09 - 12: L'Renouille Castle, exterior
09 - 13: Unknown Dungeon 2
09 - 14: Unknown Dungeon 3
09 - 15: Unknown Dungeon 4
09 - 16: Unknown Dungeon 5
09 - 17: Unknown Dungeon 6
Going by what ne__ya explored there is one more orb missing. I can't really hack the game (no idea on how to hack other than rudimentary knowledge) to explore. I don't really know if you can get all of them in one same run but you could probably use deductive reasoning to see which floor the orb is at. Like go from the 8th orb and go back to the door to see it activated on the 8th slot, go for the 7th orb to see it again on the 7th slot, go for 6th orb and see it at the 5th slot to know that the 6th orb lies somewhere in between.
- The door:
Nothing much to say since you can walk behind it indicating there was never going to be any animation to open it. Much like the Mathilda glitch (so like Konami)
Yeah, they get stronger as you progress higher. I think you can get the whole list from the standard bestiary other than the naming errors.
I noticed download/file.php?id=243
from ne__ya that there's a chest there. You could try to do something about it like hacking to see what is it or find it.
Now here's an interesting find.
In the ENG version I met the Sewer rat and fought it, got hurt etc. . All other event stairs either loop or crashes the event.
In the JPG Version I met the Poisonous Moth (Not the baby caterpillar, just to clarify). Interestingly it died the instance the battle started. It could be the cheat I used but when I turned it off it happened again.
In the JPG version I can't seem to find the sewer rat and the ENG version I can't find the Poisonous Moth. I don't remember if they appear at the same spot of stairs (I can't recall honestly) but there seems to not exist in either of them. Or they both could be at the same spot and were acting as placeholders.
I propose there are 3-5 bosses in total (one is the sewer rat or the moth or both, others crashes or loop the game). I didn't really keep track of it and the JPGver and ENGver and warping is confusing.
If the guess is correct, then the other bosses could be the 8 headed ghouls, the bone dragon, the stone golem or any other Big mini bosses throughout the game. Or they could all be placeholders.
In ENG version, using the Thor thunder I managed to glitch the graphics a bit in the dungeon. Seems pointless but it carries out when you get out of the place and into save menu. Don't know what happens if you load it again though.Pure theory:
The dungeon is meant for you to solo alone (No idea if Mchdol counts). This is on par with the Solitude rune (The one ONLY accessible through hacking) so you can handle all the bosses well alone; Its a lot harder if you don't have your party with you. Since Sajah (where the dungeon is located ) is a late game location, the player should have enough level to solo the whole place with it.
Next step: dunno, explore more?4) Request. This will help others.
-Which version is the best to test it out? Best we can come to a consensus for consistent results.
For ENG I used http://coolrom.com/roms/psx/39634/Suikoden_II.php
this rom but I can't tell which version is it. But I somehow crash when I fight Jowy for the ending. Is there any better one or emulator problem?
For JPG I used http://www.emuparadise.me/Sony_Playstat ... _II_(Japan
)/176403. I think if you use the JPG version there's more possibilities the codes are still in tact. But somehow the game does glitch occasionally.
Edit: Comments on the Roms.
-Any one has any save state?
For ENG, anyone have the save state for NO 108 STARS and preferably before the beast rune? I keep finding WITH 108 stars but it not on par with my theory below.
FOR JPG, for the love of GOD anyone has its save state? I don't want to play the whole things again especially if I can't read it.
-Cheat/Gamshark or other programs?.
Other than the wall walk, what else is there to use?
Also ne__ya, any luck in walking through walls in the JPG version? Others (God mode, money) seems to work.
Also is there any way to get out of the dungeon when in it? I can't seem to use any escape talisman whatsoever (A hint it might not even be a dungeon at all)My theory on how it all works.
1) Get NO 108 stars
2) Nanami dies (For real)
3) Rune beast fight. Win and you'll be free to walk around--alone (No recruiting).
4) Fight Jowy alone, Kill Jowy. (May not be needed. Skip to 6)
5) You'll STILL be able to walk around unlike the ending.(May not be needed. Skip to 6)
6) Go to Sajah being sad and lonely
7) Go through the dungeon alone (No idea if Mchdol counts)(Thanks to Solitude Rune making it a bit easier)
8 ) The Rune of enlightenment gives you the
9) Warp to UNKNOWN (I put unknown since SIndar/White deer Inn is pure speculation but a reasonable idea). Maybe to SIndar ruin where you get the healing herb from the chest (Its on a ziggurat, a tower maybe). Also the plaque before the healing herb chest did ask what you treasure most (You answer Friends/Family)
10) play it again and GET 108 stars
11) Nanami lives (But hidden...that lazy bitch)
12) Yada yada duel with Jowy and all the ending falls in place.
Note: If there's more to add I'll edit inside.