suikoden 2 insane challenge

[ninjaluc79]

Even if they don't deal damage, the status effects can still be pretty annoying, especially the Panic status since it's not easy to remove if you don't know what you're doing. This is especially dangerous in a solo run because you cannot control your character for a good 3-5 turns, and unless you're lucky or crazy-prepared, that character will die GUARANTEED.

[sporefrog]

thanks for the hints,and wow,thats a cool tactic with the "surviving" leg,gilded.will definitively try this,but dont forget,there is still one BIG challenge before the beast rune:
the level 2 Riou duel against Han.I have no idea,if I can beat him...

and about this negative status thing...there is still an earth armor laying around in rockaxe castle.according to the armor guide,McDohl can equip it and this piece of armor should prevent neg. status.I think,I will rush through the castle again and grab it

before facing Lucia,I redo the last battle to catch a picture from a "defeated Han" for the Video,because I "killed" Leon too earlier during the automatic war battle(thanks to Tsai´s firespears).its very hard to kill every enemy during the last war battle,but this challenge is already totally insane,so why not do this too?

[ninjaluc79]

^ Even the dreaded Panic status? My memory is quite fuzzy, but Riou and Viktor still got Panicked even with the Earth Armor on.

[sporefrog]

ok,Lucia is impossible to beat with level 38.she hits for over 200 damage per physical attack(McDohl cannot dodge),and the fire sealing rune DOESNT stop each of her spells.one of her fire spells still does around 250 damage.she attacks 3 times in a row,has higher speed and a great counter rate.McDohl with his 393 hp doesnt have a chance---->impossible.
but thats no big deal.will level him up to level 65 and try again

[gildedtalon]

Yea, after level 60, there is hardly any increase in stats, only HP

Earth Armor is a lie , it doesn't prevent any status effect whatsoever, tried it like 50 times against Beast Rune last year as well

[Antimatzist]

Yea, after level 60, there is hardly any increase in stats, only HP

Earth Armor is a lie , it doesn't prevent any status effect whatsoever, tried it like 50 times against Beast Rune last year as well

You might want to post this in Pyriels bug fixes thread, that seems strange. I never tried i myself, maybe only certain status conditions? Or it reduces the chance?

[gildedtalon]

Go try yourself, I thought I already posted about it on this forum

link to the thread: Earth Shield and Earth Armor

I personally really hate Rust status, the damage you deal will be the same as Tuta's

[sporefrog]

Lucia is finished.the battle was very easy with a fire sealing rune and a cyclone rune.she still attacked pretty hard and one of her fire spells(some kind of "fire-shuriken") remained dangerous but after a clay guardian scroll,everything was ok.

next problem:Han.
my level 2 Riou has the best available equipment.

-2 fire emblems(power +30)
-power ring(power +20)
-master garb(power +15)
-kindness rune(currently power +27)
-weapon level 13

he has a max attack power of 201 at the moment,and a normal attack as well as a wilde attack...both are useless because they do zero damage to Han.
I expected this for the regular attack but even the wilde attack does zero damage...this is very bad.

there is nothing I can do now exept waiting while the ingame-timer advances.the max (regular) value of the kindness rune should be 127.that would mean,Riou could have a max power of 301 in this challenge without cheating and without any stat stones.

waiting for the kindness rune to power up...ULTRA-ANNOYING...but I think,this is the only way,to beat Han...

I WANT A SOLITUDE RUNE!!!!!!

[Omnigamer]

I haven't tested Earth Armor, but Earth Shield definitely works. Doesn't matter much though since there are so few members of the cast that can use the shield, and McDohl isn't one of them.

As far as gilded's comments on Beast Rune, I disagree with a number of them. I'm fairly certain that Silent Lake does work, but it's ambiguous as to which attacks are actually magic. It will stop some of its attacks, but plenty will still work. You'd end up hurting yourself more, I believe, since you cut off some potential healing. On the other points regarding the Beast Rune's actions, those statements are simply wrong. The Beast Rune always gets 3 attacks each turn, and there is no guaranteed type of attack in each turn. He could simply use 3 consecutive status spells if the RNG worked out that way. By killing body parts you cut down on how many choices the RNG can choose between, but it never lowers the number of actions he gets. You can sometimes nullify actions though if you kill a body part on the same turn it was set to do an action.

@Sporefrog, I wouldn't wait out the Kindness rune and just go for the stat stones. To get it to 127 you'll need to wait another 50 hours (at least). The end effect is the same and it's not like waiting out the time reflects anything on you other than patience. At 302 power I think you'll still need 4-6 counters to take out Han though; it takes about that many regular attacks with power around 350.

One other possibility that is pretty reasonable given the programming record of this game: if you wait beyond 127 and continue to raise your kindness, there is a possibility that it will overflow and you will instead have 999 attack. I don't think anybody's tried it, but it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't put any bounds checking on it.

Nevermind about the above. I re-checked the code with the underflow in general and it won't work that way. Be very careful though; it may in fact give you -128 attack power instead if you go over.

[gildedtalon]

So are we gonna discuss a new challenge for suikoden II or other suikoden games?

Yes, the Beast Rune will always perform 3 attacks, what I was trying to say is these status effects are also choices for the 3 attacks he does every turn
And since status effects will never damage us unless it's poison but the damage is so minimal at this point, we are effectively reducing his damage/turn

Btw, there is an exception, in Punkaiser's video solo Riou against Beast Rune, you can see there's a turn where Beast Rune does nothing at all

I'm pretty sure I've tested Silent Lake on Beast Rune and Wind Rincar, it never works. You simply handicap your team while the final bosses don't get affected at all and can use magic whenever they want to

Yeah, Omnigamer is mostly right, except the Silent Lake I know for sure never works from all my tries last year and Earth Shield is still unconfirmed unless you manage to solo Beast Rune with this Earth Shield character and never get any status effect on your character after the Beast Rune tried that status ailment attack at least 5 times on the battle then I believe you

Anyway what I said about leaving that leg alive is what gets me through the solo Riou challenge after so many failures because of continous sword attack by the Beast Rune. I can't take so much damage in a turn coz we can't equip Sacrificial Jizo in battle

[Omnigamer]

I've also had turns where the Beast Rune does nothing at all. Again, it's a matter of RNG. During that turn I just happened to kill the part that was assigned all three attacks.

I get Earth Shield on Sheena in my speedrun route. I have a save at the Beast Rune that I use to practice; he has never been afflicted by a status ailment with it equipped. I call it confirmed.

[Punkaiser]

Every time the Core is destroyed, there's a rather good chance the Beast skips a turn. If you don't destroy the Core, it will never skip any turn.

[sporefrog]

to say the truth:
I invested too much to "destroy" my challenge now(dont forget,I had to restart the hole run because Gorudo was impossible with a level 22 Jowy) with stat stone usage.I never used any stones in the entire run and every former impossible battle/duel is cleared(Poison Moth,Bone Dragon,Gorudo,Amada/Luca duel)with patience,practice,testing and some of the craziest battle tactics I have ever seen.
seriously,I NEVER thought,such a challenge could be possible,I just started my own challenge "blind"...but it IS possible.I had to hit Amada with 5 wilde attacks if I remember right,so if I can beat Han with the same amount of attacks,I will do it.I wish I could save right before this battle like I could before Amada.but there was no save point before the Luca duel,and eventually,he was history too.
so I will wait,until the rune powers up and I will finish this insane challenge!!!!!!!!

50 hours is nothing.have you ever played a "final fantasy XII NLBLLG"(the hardest videogame challenge ever!) or a "final fantasy XII 122333 solo" challenge?
I am still trying to beat the Hell Wyrm with Penelo solo(final fantasy XII 122333)...

EDIT:
just wanted to post these 2 "unique" pics,because I think,no one has ever seen zero damage in this duel:


and here are my current stats(together with a magic ring and a gold emblem) for McDohl.645 is his max hp,because he could counter 2 attacks and avoid 1 fire spell with fire sealing rune just before killing her with black shadow from the soul eater:


EDIT 2:
to kill time,I am fooling around with the suikoden 2 Trial Version again.just finished the battle mode with a first turn Double Head Boss kill(Wakaba,L.C.Chan,Rina,Shiro,Riou,Jowy).
next challenge:solo battle mode

[sporefrog]

lol,Riou has now 227 power and he can damage Han already.normal attack-12 damage,wilde attack-28 damage...you will go down Han!!!!!
I just hope,my ps2 will not overheat,while waiting for the kindness rune to power up

I discovered a few interesting and maybe unknown facts,while playing the challenge:

VIKI
according to the recruitment guide here,she joins automatically.this is NOT true.
I spoke to her with a level 1 castle and later with a level 2 Castle,and I could refuse her.she is an optional star.

WAR BATTLES
if you kill a "killable" star like Koyu or Tuta,and you see the death speach on the screen,the character will sometimes remain alive and you will only see the "wounded" report.so it seems,there is still another rng AFTER the death speach.
in my first challenge,I could never kill Tuta,if he was in Fliks unit,in my current challenge,he had to be in Fliks unit,otherwise I allways got the wounded-message.very strange.same with Gijimu.Gijimu was unkillabe in Valerias,Fliks and Viktors unit.after putting him in Teresas unit,he died.

WAR BATTLES
Gijimu is a killable star,but you cannot kill him before the rockaxe mission briefing,because his sprite shows up in the meeting hall.so in fact,you can only kill him during the last 2 war battles.

WAR BATTLES
put Tsai and Chaco in Viktors unit right before the automatic war battle against Leon.Tsai can kill Leon with his firespears and Chaco will allow Viktor to reach Leon early enough.this is the only way to see Leons defeat speach.

WAR BATTLES
you can kill Seed AND Han during the last war battle,but its extremly difficult.after receiving one "sword" damage,they allways retreat to the middle of the city and recover.
you can still kill them,if one is in the middle of the City and you attack the other with full force.after receiving damage,he cannot retreat,because the recovering spot is blocked by the other unit(usually by Han).you need a critical hit for this(Ridley,Shu or Shin can do that) and some other sort of damage like firespears or Lucs wind magic and even Flik can damage the enemy with his arrows sometimes.
I could not beat Culgan,but he was the last unit alive during the final war battle,and I am sure,he is killabe too with more luck or with another strategy,but bringing Han,Seed,and Lucia down with the minimum amount of stars(units) in the game was enough for me

MT.RAKUTEI
if you do the matilda trick and remove Futch and Humphrey from your party in the mercenary fortress before finishing the dragon egg quest,these 2 guys will NOT dissapear forever.they will wait for you at the bottom of the mountain.so you can still visit Rakutei,even after beeing in Renouille.I strongly belive,they will still wait there after the beast rune,but I am not sure.will test it.

POISON MOTH
If you can kill this monster within 3 turns,the battle will end normally.if you kill it later or if you die,the battle will interrupt,and after a special scene,Riou will get exp. points and level up.

[Sasarai10]

Good luck in your duel against Han...it's gonna be really tough,and probably you would smash your game along with your console,after multiple misses...even your whole house,who knows?


I think it doesn't matter if Gijimu's sprite show up in the meeting hall or not...if you remember Gadget and Mukumuku appear in the meeting hall too,who are both optional,and if you don't recruit them,their sprites will be replaced with a regular soldier's one.