Bug Fixes

If you are stuck in the Dunan Unification Wars; or wish for more details on the gameplay systems, this is the place.
suikokid2
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby suikokid2 » Fri Jun 23, 2017 1:29 pm

Pyriel wrote:If you're this interested in determining whether or not it works in a particular version, why wouldn't you try it a few times? It'd take like 5 minutes. Find a stat stone, save, check your stats, use the stone, go out and die, "Don't Give Up", check your stats, and repeat. You say you don't "think" it worked. Well, write a few things down and confirm it. Take a picture or two, if you can manage it. We'll all thank you when Raww can add an errata section to his article and correct the record.

Yeah hopefully Raww will be around :) And ok

suikokid2
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby suikokid2 » Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:14 am

Pyriel wrote:If you're this interested in determining whether or not it works in a particular version, why wouldn't you try it a few times? It'd take like 5 minutes. Find a stat stone, save, check your stats, use the stone, go out and die, "Don't Give Up", check your stats, and repeat. You say you don't "think" it worked. Well, write a few things down and confirm it. Take a picture or two, if you can manage it. We'll all thank you when Raww can add an errata section to his article and correct the record.

Btw one thing i dont understand, if stat stone trick isnt in the PSP version why would konami and suikosource say it is?

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Pyriel
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:25 pm

I don't think Konami ever said it was there. Developers and publishers usually don't make claims like that unless it's something they're putting in the ads or on the box. I guess it could be in the instruction manual, or in a guide if one was published for this version. I doubt it, though. That is, it wasn't in the manual for the PS version, so it'd be weird to document the feature ten years later. And I very much doubt they'd have done anything other than re-release the PS guide, assuming there was one, and they felt like a re-release would sell.

I don't think it's explicitly stated on this site that the stat stones are exploitable. The exploit probably wasn't checked because it didn't seem particularly important, and it's just taken as implicit that it's still there because the guide says, "no bugs aside from the Matilda Glitch were fixed," or words to that effect. We don't even know that implying it's there is false yet, because nobody has done the work to confirm.

As to how such a theoretical mistake could have been made, well, not many people in the West were that interested in this remake, and similarly few people have your weird, laser-focus on getting correct information about a trivial mechanic in a remake that maybe a few hundred people outside Japan have played. That focus would be admirable, if it didn't also involve constantly harassing other people to develop the information for you.

rangerike
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby rangerike » Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:25 pm

So how many of these bugs were in the original Japanese version?

Omnigamer
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Omnigamer » Mon Jun 26, 2017 1:21 am

Basically all of them, except the music-related errors. Those are only available in the US release.

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Pyriel
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:57 am

There are a few more exceptions, but music is the big one that Japan didn't get.
  1. In the US version only, there are lines of dialogue missing for Gremio in Banner Village that cause gibberish text at best, and crashes at worst.
  2. In the US version only, the Suikoden name values (hero and castle) are copied over incorrectly.
  3. In the US version only, a good many audio tracks, including music and sound effects, will not play because of an issue when the disc was mastered.
  4. The Tinto Glitch is not present in the Japanese version, as it's (likely) due to an area module being cloned when it got too large during localization. I think the issue is present in the European versions as well, but I can't recall if I did any work to confirm it. It may only be in certain versions. It depends on whether or not a specific localization effort caused the original module to grow beyond the 300KB limit.
  5. There are two bugs in the German version that involve a "blank" option being added to event choices. If I remember correctly, one is during the Two River battle, and it's a blank line below the "Fight!" options. The other is in Gregminster when you first visit. These are localization issues that I believe are due to line lengths and the weird ways choices can be specified in dialogue and menus.
  6. This isn't really a bug, but translation issues abound. Obviously there are no translation problems in the Japanese game, but they're numerous and vary wildly in the western versions. In the US, we get untranslated text all over the place, lines that seem out of place, cats that say, "Sonya," and so on. The UK version has the translation mostly completed, but retains the bulk of the other problems. Meanwhile the German version has arguably the worst translation, with simple mistakes like, "chain mail/armor," being translated to, "chain letter," all over the place.

That's about it. Everything else started in Japan, and carried through to the rest of the regions. By my estimate that's about 26/31 known bugs and issues, not counting translation quibbles, or odd things we can't confirm are actually bugs, like Tai Ho not getting import bonuses.
Last edited by Pyriel on Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:00 am, edited 2 times in total.

Antimatzist
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Antimatzist » Tue Jun 27, 2017 10:32 am

Just to correct something, while sometimes nonsensical, the German translation was at least German. I remember a Spanish fan talking about the Spanish translation and at times, he didn't know whether the game was Spanish or Italian (probably neither). Bottomline - all European translations of the game are probably among the worst localizations of JRPGs ever.

But the German version introduced two game crashing bugs, so yeah, not so hot.

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Pyriel
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Tue Jun 27, 2017 10:57 am

Oh yeah, I forgot about those.

And all the Romance translations probably used Esperanto whenever something was in doubt.

suikokid2
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby suikokid2 » Wed Jun 28, 2017 7:33 pm

Pyriel wrote:I don't think Konami ever said it was there. Developers and publishers usually don't make claims like that unless it's something they're putting in the ads or on the box. I guess it could be in the instruction manual, or in a guide if one was published for this version. I doubt it, though. That is, it wasn't in the manual for the PS version, so it'd be weird to document the feature ten years later. And I very much doubt they'd have done anything other than re-release the PS guide, assuming there was one, and they felt like a re-release would sell.

I don't think it's explicitly stated on this site that the stat stones are exploitable. The exploit probably wasn't checked because it didn't seem particularly important, and it's just taken as implicit that it's still there because the guide says, "no bugs aside from the Matilda Glitch were fixed," or words to that effect. We don't even know that implying it's there is false yet, because nobody has done the work to confirm.

As to how such a theoretical mistake could have been made, well, not many people in the West were that interested in this remake, and similarly few people have your weird, laser-focus on getting correct information about a trivial mechanic in a remake that maybe a few hundred people outside Japan have played. That focus would be admirable, if it didn't also involve constantly harassing other people to develop the information for you.

Stats glitch is there....

http://suikosource.com/games/gs2/secrets/

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Antimatzist » Thu Jun 29, 2017 1:31 am

Pyriel was talking about stat stones in the PSP remake.

suikokid2
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby suikokid2 » Thu Jun 29, 2017 2:03 pm

I was just showing it is listed on the site.

Swordmaster
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Jun 29, 2017 2:51 pm

I've been playing with the Bug Fix patch, and I might have come across a problem.... In order to defeat Rowd, I saved before meeting Nanami and continued the game without saving until I casually pushed aside the gate leading to Rockaxe. Obviously, I didn't apply that part of the patch. I went up a few levels before getting a Game Over and Retrying. I had received 1 or 2 one-time-only items from encounters. Seed Potato was one I'm sure I got. However... I've been trying to get these items again, but they aren't showing up. I no longer have them because of the Game Over, so I should be able to get them again, right? I've received about 10 or so Thunder Amulets from the ZombieSlugs, but no Recipe #29. Any idea what's going on here?

Swordmaster
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Jun 29, 2017 3:36 pm

Nevermind. Apparently I got Recipe #29 and Sound Set #2 and forgot about it. So it's only the Seed Potato that I can't get. I'll keep trying. Just disregard my previous post.

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Pyriel
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Thu Jun 29, 2017 6:12 pm

For what it's worth, the bug fix patch only has an effect if you give the collectibles to their respective people in the castle. When an item is just sitting in your inventory, none of the bug fixes address anything to do with that. If for some reason you can't get the potato seed again, it would probably be due to either bad luck, or a previously undiscovered bug of some kind.

Swordmaster
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Jun 29, 2017 10:51 pm

Yeah, sorry, I shouldn't have jumped to conclusions so soon. I don't know why I was so convinced I had found some kind of bug. That was a bit uncharacteristic of me.

On another note... the amount of spelling and grammar errors is astounding! I had forgotten just how badly localized this game was. Reminds me of Lufia: The Legend Returns. I wonder if anyone will ever attempt to fix the script? I can't help but screen shot the hilariously bad parts. lol

And one last thing: It was either in this thread or the Game Shark codes thread where it was mentioned that characters have lines that are impossible to see in normal play. I would like to add (if I'm in the right thread) that Humphrey and Futch have lines in many different situations well before they are supposed to be recruited. So it's likely true that way more was written than what was used. This game is a masterpiece in many ways.


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