Bug Fixes

If you are stuck in the Dunan Unification Wars; or wish for more details on the gameplay systems, this is the place.
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Pyriel
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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Sat Jul 01, 2017 9:36 am

suikokid2 wrote:I was just showing it is listed on the site.

I was talking about the PSP differences guide (here). That GS2 secrets page was written something like 10 years before the PSP version came out. You'll notice it says the Matilda Glitch is there as well, with no exception mentioned for the PSP remake. Someone could amend it, if they have the time, to mention places where the PSP version differs. Assuming there are other places. But in general, the reason that PSP differences guide exists is to provide the information without having to comb through every page on the site, adding version-specific qualifier in who knows how many places.

You can suggest such fixes in the Website Forum, typically in the miscellaneous errors thread. Bearing in mind that this is a community maintained resource, and the universe isn't somehow broken if a 10-year-old page wasn't immediately updated, or if the information provided isn't exhaustive and immaculate.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Aug 17, 2017 1:52 am

Found something very odd today. Unequipped Chaco's Sun Badge, and he can't re-equip it. Is this normal? I reloaded to get a screen shot of it greyed out in Chaco's equip menu.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Antimatzist » Thu Aug 17, 2017 11:24 am

Yeah, according to the equipment guide, he can't equip it. Once you unequip it, that's it.
https://www.suikosource.com/games/gs2/guides/armor.php

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Thu Aug 17, 2017 6:23 pm

Most likely they decided Chaco wasn't youthful enough for badges, and didn't correct his starting equipment. There's an outside chance he's been wearing it since he was a kid, and taking it off permanently is some sort of symbolism. I doubt it, but that's probably the half-joking answer you'd get if you asked any of the developers.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Aug 17, 2017 10:20 pm

lol, that's so strange. I can't believe I never noticed this the millions of times I've been through this game. Thanks for the explanations, guys.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:13 am

Noticed two oddities at Gregminster. I've been using a code that was listed in the Gameshark Codes thread for 9 of every Rare Find. The code works everywhere except one place, Gregminster Rune Shop. Anyone know why that is? Seems strange to me.

The other thing was right after recruiting Lorelai (with Killey, for extra dialog). Told her to come with us, went into the menu and no matter what I do the game crashes as soon as I exit the menu. If I walk into a building first, the crash doesn't happen. If I tell her to go to HQ, the crash doesn't happen. Also, I get this error message:

"Error running ePSXe
unknown opcode BDBAA27A at 8000009C"

I don't know if I did something weird or if this is some sort of known bug? Any thoughts? I kept the state, if that helps. I'll hold onto that save, too, just in case.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:01 am

As to the code, if it has a line that starts with a "5" in it, that's what's sometimes referred to as a "slide" code. It just writes the same value to many places in memory. It probably just doesn't write to enough places to cover that shop's rare finds.

That error in the emulator usually means there was garbage interpreted as code somewhere. It's possible you triggered dialog that doesn't exist, like when Gremio speaks gibberish in Banner. However, the fact that going into a building fixes it implies something more like the Tinto glitch, where a module was split during localization, the wrong copy gets loaded because something was missed, and the current state of the game can't be properly handled.

If you're running with the patch, can you try the scenario after loading your save using an unpatched copy of the game? So far as I can recall, the only patch applied to Gregminster was a byte or two that made the rare finds in one shop hit against the right timer and inventory regardless of where you were standing when you talked to the shopkeeper. It shouldn't affect anything else, but I'd like to rule out the patch before we start investigating a potentially new bug. Also, turn off the code, in case it's doing something undesirable.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:18 pm

Hmm.... Well, I just retraced my steps. Loaded my save, no codes at all, vanilla Suikoden II, same crash. It's not from the patch, it's not because of a save state, and it's not from any code (unless the damage was done a long time ago, maybe?).

Notes: Brought both Kasumi and Killey, tried to recruit Lorelai immediately after McDohl event. Also, died on purpose during boss fight to witness Forgiver Sign. (Not sure if any of this had anything to do with it.)

I'm going to try one more thing. I'll completely finish McDohl quest to dump Gremio from convoy, see if that changes anything.

Edit: Ok, nevermind. Saving and loading right before recruiting Lorelai fixes the issue. No more crash, both vanilla and patched. Could it be something broke in RAM somewhere between the Worm boss fight, Kasumi & McDohl bonus event, and Killey & Lorelai bonus event?

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:53 pm

Sorry for the double post, but I forgot to report this a while back. One instance of "Circuret" was possibly overlooked. (Not that it is at all important...)

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:34 pm

It's possible that there's some upstream corruption going that far back, but it's more likely you took a slightly different path through the events. If you can upload your memory card, I'll see if I can recreate it.

Something I forgot about earlier, but we also have the crash in Greenhill when you choose an unlikely option during the scenario, and then immediately change your mind in the next prompt. I don't know if anybody had ever reported that one until Omnigamer experienced it in a speedrun. That was just due to an omitted "release handle" command of some sort.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Swordmaster » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:25 pm

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bqzwro6obs9ai ... I.mcr?dl=0

I think that's how it works... If that didn't work, let me know. Save Game 2 is the one you want. It's right before the Worm boss fight. Time is low because of a code to zero it out for Clive Quest. Heh.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby SCM » Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:05 pm

Hello everyone. First of all, I want to thank you Pyriel for your wonderful work. I can easily call Suikoden II the game of my life, but since 2001 I replayed it so many times that I just lost my motivation, especially since I don't have that much time anymore and I can't even play it properly (on PSN you can only choose between slow letterboxed EU version and bugged USA version).

But now that we have the possibility of playing the NTSC version without the glitches, I'm really looking forward to replay the trilogy once again. Thank you very much Sir.

Before I patch the games, I have a few little questions:

1) I have BIN + CUE files of the game and I also rendered IMG + CUE with ImgBurn. Which option will be more suitable?

2) Does it matter that there are two files - BIN/IMG + CUE?

I remember patching Genso Suikogaiden games (translation) with IMG + CUE files and they work fine despite advice in 'readme' to use ISO file.

3) Can you confirm that I will be perfectly fine with my v1.0 of Suikoden 1? Or is there any specific reason to look for the v1.1?

The rest of the questions aren't really any issues, it's more like I would like to know your opinion.

4) You gave my OCD really hard time with the Kindness Rune thing. I don't know whether to choose the option with 'penalty' or not..

Putting aside guessing the programmers intentions, which option seems better for the fair gameplay in your opinion?

5) Just out of curiosity - is there anything that your patched NTSC-U version is missing compared to the PAL version?
Is there any reason to choose it over your repaired one?

That would be all. As for the patches I decided not to use:

- Krin and Stallion escape talismans - I think that it suits their characters to have those items glitched that way.

- Gozz Rune and True Holy Rune names - I rather have those consistent with the other games from the trilogy (THR in S1 and Goss Rune in SIII). Besides, I'm so used to them that it can't bother me.

One more time - thank you for your precious time and effort to make this beautiful game even better. It's great to have such talented people as Suikoden fans :)

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:32 pm

Surely.

  1. It doesn't have to be a .iso. Oftentimes BIN and IMG files contain an ISO image anyway. That advice is there mainly because some disc-rippers create proprietary formats or decorate an ISO image with proprietary headers. If the patcher hangs up trying to read the file, or throws a read exception of some kind, you may need to find a different image, but there's no reason not to try what you have. It will probably work.
  2. No, it doesn't matter, but don't use the CUE file as a source/input image. The patch utility is meant for plain ISOs. It doesn't care about or need such metadata.
  3. I'm not even sure why the original Suikoden has a version 1.1. The only difference seems to be one additional bug. There's no reason to seek it out just to play it.
  4. Personally, I thought the penalty version made the most sense. Firstly, it just makes sense for being mean to have a negative impact. Secondly, it seemed like the most likely intent of the code. Thirdly, it forces you to use items or spells to revive characters if they die in minor battles, rather than exploiting the automatic revival. Although, the encouragement is only there if you care that a particular character can't use the Kindness Rune. Still, it feels like the sort of thing that would be thrown in to balance out the game resurrecting your team for free.

    On the other hand, the system is a tedious bit of relationship decay, which I usually find troublesome, and you still get less of a bonus all the way down to no bonus without the penalty anyway. With either version, getting down to -10 Kindness means you have to earn 11 points just to get any bonus at all. It's up to you to decide how much you want to suffer for leaving a fallen comrade behind too many times.
  5. I can't think of anything that would be missing in a patched US version vs. PAL. In fact, with the patch, playing the PAL version would mean you miss out on a few fixes. Although most of the patches that haven't been ported are easily avoidable bugs that don't impact completion, if memory serves. For instance, there's no real reason to care if Emalia calls Riou by his real name or his alias during the Greenhill events, and the Tinto Glitch is easy to avoid.

I hadn't looked at the GS1 patch in a long time. To the point I was pleasantly surprised that it's as up-to-date as it is, and patches can be toggled. It was so long ago, I thought it surely must be a straight PPF.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby SCM » Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:29 am

Thanks Pyriel, everything's clear now.

I just patched both games and I was notified that the process was successful.

But there is a problem - in both cases the size of the created patched file is right but the file has no extension. It's not like 'BIN file' or 'IMG file', it's just 'File'. Because of that, emulators can't recognize the file. I also tried to mount it somehow in DAEMON Tools Lite by using the CUE file of the original image but with no success.

Am i missing something or the BIN file that I used is not suitable and I should try with the IMG or ISO? Or is there any way to make the created image recognizable as BIN?

Edit: Here's the setting up patch dialog from Suikoden:
gs1patch.rar

And Suikoden II:
gs2patch.rar


Edit 2: I just pasted the extension ".bin" to both files and they immediately turned into BIN. Everything works fine now. So i assume they were BIN files from the start, just unrecognized. But is it a proper way to do that kind of thing? I don't want to ruin the whole process somehow so I'm a little bit worried.

(I have to explain - these are my final days on Windows XP before I move to W7 and because I heard that WXP is better for patching, I would like to have everything done before I change my system.)

And the last question - because the patcher created only the BIN file, I copied the CUE file from the original image and now they are both in the same folder named as "SUIKODEN" / "SUIKODEN II". It seems to work fine - both emulator and DAEMON Tools Lite recognize the file thanks to CUE.

But just to be sure - won't there be any conflict? Since only the BIN file was patched, is it possible that CUE will provide some errors?
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Last edited by SCM on Fri Dec 08, 2017 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Bug Fixes

Postby Pyriel » Fri Dec 08, 2017 12:01 pm

"Writing patch to: E:\Emulation\GS2\SUIKODEN II\SUIKODEN II "

It looks like that's what you told it to do, write the output to a file without an extension. Just rename it in Windows Explorer and it should be fine. The cue sheet wouldn't help unless you edited it to indicate it's now for that particular file. Even then, I'm not sure it would be enough to help the emulator discover the format if it won't do it automatically from the ISO's structure.


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