[Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

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ReyVGM
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[Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby ReyVGM » Sat Dec 19, 2015 1:38 pm

I've been playing Suikoden a second time after... 20 years or so, so basically I'm pretty much playing it from scratch as far as memory is concerned. One thing that I always wanted to figure out were the ending variations (not the character epilogues). What would happen if I didn't recruit or if I killed one of those characters that appear in the ending. And so far, there doesn't seem to be anyplace on the Internet where the full ending is completely detailed.
So I would like if more knowledgeable guys like you can help me out with that. On the second post I'll detail my findings, but please take a look at the questions below and see if you can help.

On the ending scene where there are a bunch of characters cheering (Tai Ho, Lepant, Kirkis, Sylvina, Cleo, Pahn, Hix, Tengaar, Futch, Humphrey, Gen, Kamandol), I know Pahn will not appear if he died, but what about the other characters?

This page (http://shrines.rpgclassics.com/psx/suik ... nits.shtml) says Gen and Kamandol can die in combat, so I used a Gameshark code to make it appear as if I never recruited them, and also to have them dead (greyed out on the mural), yet they still appeared in that scene.
The same page says Tai Ho, Lepant, Kirkis, Sylvina, Cleo, Hix, Tengaar, Futch, and Humphrey cannot die in combat, but which of those are missable recruits, and if you miss them, will they still appear in that ending scene or not?

I used a gameshark code to have those characters dead, and they still appeared in the scene. Has anyone seen a scene with one of them missing?
Last edited by ReyVGM on Sat Dec 19, 2015 2:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ReyVGM
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Joined: Sat Dec 19, 2015 1:26 pm

Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby ReyVGM » Sat Dec 19, 2015 1:42 pm

The ending is composed of several scenes.

Scene 1:
After defeating Barbarosa, there is a dialogue exchange between him, Kasim and Windy. Barbarosa ends up committing suicide and taking Windy with him.
This scene can vary.
Kasim will enter the room if he's not in your party. If he's in your party, then he'll just step out of your character.
Sonya, Milich, and Kwanda will also enter the room if you didn't have them in your party and each has one line of dialogue in the scene. If you had those characters in your party or if they died in combat, then they will not appear in the scene at all.
Flik and Viktor will always appear since they are mandatory characters for the last battle and they cannot die in combat.

Scene 2:
The escape. This scene contains no variations other than what you answer to Flik or Viktor when they choose to stay behind and fight the enemies.

Scene 3:
Outside the castle.
There's a scene where it shows several characters (Tai Ho, Lepant, Kirkis, Sylvina, Cleo, Pahn, Hix, Tengaar, Futch, Humphrey, Gen, Kamandol) cheering.
If Pahn died, then he will not appear in the scene.
I used a gameshark code to have Tai Ho, Lepant, Kirkis, Sylvina, Cleo, Hix, Tengaar, Futch, Humphrey, Gen, and Kamandol dead or non-recruited and they still appeared in the ending.

Scene 4:
It shows Likuan and a bed-ridden Mathiu. Mathiu dies.
This scene cannot be changed.

Scene 5:
The epilogues for all characters you collected. If you missed a character, then their text box will be empty. Except a few characters, which have multiple epilogues.
Gremio:
If you never revive him, it will say he died in the Soniere Prison. If you revived him, then it says he follows the hero.
Pahn:
If he lost the Teo McDohl battle, then it will say so. If he survived the battle, then it will say he embarked on a journey.
Sancho:
If Maximilian died in combat, then it will say Sancho places flowers on Max's grave. If Maximilian didn't die, then it says he continues to serve him.
Tengaar:
Tengaar has a second epilogue, but it's not accessible in the final game. So basically, he only has one official epilogue.
Gon:
Gon has two epilogues, but they are both exactly the same.

If a character died in combat, then his text box will say one of these lines depending on which battle he died in:
-Pannu Yakuta Castle, Killed fighting Kwanda
-Killed at the Battle of Garan
-Scarleticia Castle, Killed fighting Milich
-Killed fighting Teo
-Northern Checkpoint, Killed fighting Griffith
-Shasarazade Floating Fortress, Killed fighting Sonya
-The Final Battle, Killed fighting Yuber

Scene 6:
Credits. Always the same.

Scene 7:
The end.
If Gremio was not revived, then it shows the hero leaving alone, and a drawing of him will appear.
If Gremio was revived, then it shows both of them leaving, and a drawing of both of them will appear.

Antimatzist
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby Antimatzist » Sun Dec 20, 2015 4:48 am

Gen and Kamandol cannot die.
http://www.suikosource.com/games/gs1/gu ... attles.php

All the characters from your first post are mandatory, you cannot miss a single one of them.

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Celes
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby Celes » Sun Dec 20, 2015 7:18 am

Yes, RPGClassics is wrong. Gen and Kamandol will always be alive at the end.
The rest of your list is complete.

ReyVGM
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby ReyVGM » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:18 am

Thanks.

Yeah I kinda got the hint once I "killed" all those characters using gameshark codes and the only one that was removed was Pahn. Anyway, I took screenshots of the entire ending with all the variations in case anyone wants to see:
http://www.vgmuseum.com/end/psx/b/suikoden.htm

Antimatzist
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby Antimatzist » Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:37 am

Nice!

It was still worth a try. There are some dialogues in the code which don't ever appear in the game, simply because the required character cannot die or cannot be recruited at that point.

ReyVGM
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby ReyVGM » Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:33 pm

Yep, saw a thread here talking about it.
I want to do the same for Suiko 2, but I think it might have too many variations for me to try.

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Sasarai10
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby Sasarai10 » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:56 am

This list has some mistakes. Of course Gen and Kamandohl cannot die....not Kasim as well.

Also it's impossible to get killed in the war battle against Teo. No matter how much i tried, nobody got killed.

ReyVGM
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby ReyVGM » Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:43 pm

In the second battle against him, no one can die? So that message "Killed in the battle against Teo" is unused?
Only Pahn has the message then? Although it says Teo McDohl.

It would be great if someone edited that endings guide here and added an (unused) to the endings that can't really be achieved.

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Celes
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby Celes » Thu Dec 24, 2015 5:53 am

ReyVGM wrote:In the second battle against him, no one can die? So that message "Killed in the battle against Teo" is unused?
Only Pahn has the message then? Although it says Teo McDohl.

It would be great if someone edited that endings guide here and added an (unused) to the endings that can't really be achieved.

Done.

ReyVGM
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby ReyVGM » Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:46 pm

Great, thanks!

If possible, could you also add the conditions to get the alternative Epilogues? Since there really isn't one specific place where you can find that info. I'll just paste the info here in case you don't want to type anything:

Gremio
If Gremio Is Not Revived:
Dies protecting <Hero> in Soniere Prison.
If Gremio Is Revived:
Follows <Hero>.

Pahn
If Pahn Doesn't Survive The Duel Against Teo:
Dies fighting Teo McDohl.
If Pahn Survives The Duel Against Teo:
Embark on a journey to improve his imperfect self.

Sancho
If Maximilian Dies in Combat:
Places flowers on his master's grave daily.
If Maximilian Doesn't Die in Combat:
Happily continues to serve his master.

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Sasarai10
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby Sasarai10 » Mon Dec 28, 2015 2:44 pm

ReyVGM wrote:In the second battle against him, no one can die? So that message "Killed in the battle against Teo" is unused?
Only Pahn has the message then? Although it says Teo McDohl.

It would be great if someone edited that endings guide here and added an (unused) to the endings that can't really be achieved.


I tried using arrows and magic often,which are weak against Teo but still nothing happened. And yeah there are some unused endings like the one with Tengaar. They supposed to make Hix kills me I guess,but they changed it.

One thing I don't understand is why Kanak and Leonardo have the same ending even if Anji gets killed. :|

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Celes
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Re: [Help] Ending variations, who can/cannot appear, etc.

Postby Celes » Tue Jan 19, 2016 12:21 pm

Yeah. Long before being able to rip those quotes from the disc, I tried to kill them while playing all the way to the ending lines to see their alternative quotes, which doesn't exist.


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