So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

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Piisuke
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby Piisuke » Tue Jan 14, 2014 3:20 am

sticky-runes wrote:Pesmerga is basically the Boba Fett of Suikoden. He does F.A. but we're supposed to like him because he's got a cool helmet and we don't know much about him :roll:


Most characters do very little, if anything. I can't remember Fu Su Lu doing much in the castle. What about Gon? Joshua? Stallion? Kirke?

You're not supposed to like him, because he "has a cool helmet", people like him, because he is mysterious and looks dangerous. The entire game you recruit people like Sarah and average looking people, so for a person to look like Pesmerga to join your army, players get excited. Pesmerga has presence, an aura.
Aside from that, the long standing idea behind him was that the truth between him and Yuber was considered too important to reveal until the last Suikoden game. The chances of that happening are unlikely, but there was a lot more behind them two than we were told.

Anyway, this topic is now derailing into a Pesmerga yay/nay topic, as opposed to the comments made by Bruce.

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sticky-runes
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby sticky-runes » Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:55 am

The entire game you recruit people like Sarah and average looking people


There's nothing average about the woman who washes Imperial blood and monster guts out of everyone's clothes, and discretely cleans over 108 sets of dirty underwear!

And also, Marie and the cooks give us bed and board, Sansuke gives us a place to clean up, and thanks to Sergei our old doctor doesn't have to wear himself out going up and down all those cold, hard stairs. They all deserve more credit! :P

Now back to Mr and Mrs Printscreen.

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BrucePrintscreen
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby BrucePrintscreen » Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:41 am

So that's it, she finished the game!

She actually kicked the hydra's ass very easily. She stuck to her favourite team: Tir/Viktor/Flik on first row, Sarah/Kai/Kasumi on second row. They were like level 57 and she had zero difficulties beating the hydra.

She was totally into it, playing like a pro and requiring no help from me - and remember, this is a person who never played an RPG before. What a difference with 20 hours of game earlier when she couldn't understand how the Item function worked and she thought the very idea of turn-by-turn was looking weird (now she thinks it's actually nice but just weird for an outsider).

As I expected she made a big, Luke Skywalker-like, "NOOOOOOOOO!!!" when Viktor said he would stay behind while you escape the castle. Watching the credits she kept on saying "see, it says 'missing in action', not dead, so perhaps he lived, right?" She named him her favourite character of all. Gameplay-wise, though, she said her favourite was Kasumi, for the following reasons: simple to play yet efficient, and very reliable, she liked Kasumi for always playing first and for practically never missing an attack (that's what she cringed about Viktor constantly, he misses a lot of hits, towards the end of the game anytime he missed an attack she said "ah, that's Viktor all the way!")

All in all, it's crazy how the game appealed to such an unlikely audience for an RPG. She concurred that Suikoden is "the Gormenghast of videogames" and mentioned it as such to some acquaintances she told about her new fad. Everyone was kind of surprised to see a 30 something young mother with zero geek background (and whose husband is merely into such stuff either) speaking enthusiastically about a videogame, it was perceived as out of character. Because I know her very well and because I know the game very well, I have the opposite opinon: I know she likes a good story and I knew how good a story Suikoden is.

Another thing she liked, and I actually agree: while being clearly Japanese in style, the game is not abusively "anime" style. Because none of us two has any interest in anime or manga culture, we may have had it difficult to enter something that looked very much like it. This game is very accessible and appealing for someone like us.

She wanted to start Suikoden II straight away: the opening cinematics made me shiver and I couldn't believe that years after my teenage experience of that game I was sharing it with someone. Seeing my reaction when Luca Blight appears on the cinematics, I said he was the Adolf Hitler of videogames (yeah I'm fond of such comparisons). She saw Viktor & Flik at the end of the cinematics and was so happy to see them back.

She played straight to just before the Mist monster. She says flik looks melancholy and must be thinking of Odessa (I don't know where she got that from), and she says she loves the music. She is very relieved not to have to go through the tedious process of equiping and selling anymore because it's half automated in SII (she hated that in SI). She found it strange that you start the game by doing freaking chores but it didn't impede her interest in the game. She is, off course, already jealous of Rina.

More to follow...

Makonuchi
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby Makonuchi » Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:59 am

Totally agree with you on the anime thing. It's pretty darn bold for Konami to do so considering how obsessed japanese people are with anime, and even with the animish opening in Suikoden three, the game didn't look animish at all.

Oh man, I can wait for your next post when she sees the classic "Die Pig Die!" from Luca.

I will be playing Suikoden When I get married that's for sure.

Oh and I know you haven't played the rest of the games, but you should totally check out Suikoden V. It's the closet to Suikoden 1 and 2 and many people share the opinion that it was superior in Story and character development than Suiko 1 and 2 which says a lot about the game..

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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby Antimatzist » Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:32 am

Yeah, in contrast to other RPG series, Suikoden mostly avoids these anime tropes (we get more than enough typical RPG stuff, though.)

I'm sure your wife will enjoy II a lot more, but hearing stuff from people who play the games for the first time is really interesting. I hope you'll play the rest of the series together, at least the 5 main games.

When I move together with my girlfriend later this year, I'm sure I'll try and ask her if she liked to play the game again, now with me silently sitting nearby. But my girlfriend sucks at things with a story. Everytime we watch a movie that I already know she starts asking endgame stuff after 10 minutes into the film. I try to avoid it, but it's hard to show a neutral reaction.

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BrucePrintscreen
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby BrucePrintscreen » Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:04 pm

She kept on playing up to just before Luca's attack on Viktor's fort. A few other thoughts:

-SHe already found the Giant Snail ennemies hilarious in SI because of their elongated necks. SHe cheered when they reappeared in SII and found them even funnier because they make a faint moaning noise when they attack.

-When Millie asked if Bonaparte is nice she had Riou answering "I don't know about that.." however, since then, she plays Millie's Rune all the time just for the fun of it.

-She was not especially impressed by the "die pig" line but she hates Luca enough now. She was very surprised by the attack over Toto.

-When asked how to name the company, she named it "Pilika Company".

-Her characters are weaker than when she played SI because now she's even more in the storyline and rushes to advance it rather than building up her characters. She was slower when playing SI.

-Last but not least: she cheered loudly when Viktor & Flik rescues you from execution to Rowd's men. That was a "I LOVE VIKTOR" moment. I'm happy because I always enjoyed that scene very much, they come up as such great heroes.

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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby Sasarai10 » Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:31 pm

Off-topic but i discovered a funny fact about Pesmerga recently...that he actually has feelings :!:

If you speak to him,at the point when Huan has taken Nanami to the clinic (before he anounces her death),Pesmerga instead of saying "HMMM....." he'll just say ".........................."


So i thought that this guy has actually got feelings about how Riou feels at this point of the game or sth like that :P

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BrucePrintscreen
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby BrucePrintscreen » Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:56 am

Oh I forgot about this topic! The latest laugh is how she thinks that, when characters do a Rune, it looks like they give the finger to ennemies (this was especially true with Tir in the first game).

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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby Sasarai10 » Wed Jan 29, 2014 5:18 am

BrucePrintscreen wrote:Oh I forgot about this topic! The latest laugh is how she thinks that, when characters do a Rune, it looks like they give the finger to ennemies (this was especially true with Tir in the first game).



Hahaha have you seen Hai Yo using a Rune? He is very funny....he lift up his wok along with spoon to cast the spell. Gantetsu is very funny too,where he puts out his necklake to cast the spell

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BrucePrintscreen
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby BrucePrintscreen » Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:51 am

Sasarai10 wrote:
BrucePrintscreen wrote:Oh I forgot about this topic! The latest laugh is how she thinks that, when characters do a Rune, it looks like they give the finger to ennemies (this was especially true with Tir in the first game).



Hahaha have you seen Hai Yo using a Rune? He is very funny....he lift up his wok along with spoon to cast the spell. Gantetsu is very funny too,where he puts out his necklake to cast the spell


Oh I'll try that! I'm busy playing my own game besides hers and decided to use different characters than usual. For example I put Shin and Shilo in my team as I go to Rockaxe for the first time, they're actually cool, I like Shilo's poison rune.

I stick to Rina & Eilie though, otherwise I wouldn't have the impression that I'm playing SII at all

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ItsDaveyJ
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby ItsDaveyJ » Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:46 am

In regards to the "anime" aspect of the games... that's why I didn't enjoy Suikoden 5. For my personal tastes... it felt way too cliche modern anime and lost touch with the nice blend of anime with some western story telling elements. I always enjoyed Suikoden having this nice middle ground between eastern and western sensibilities. It's something that is actually quite difficult for games to pull off.

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BrucePrintscreen
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby BrucePrintscreen » Thu Jan 30, 2014 3:56 am

I totally agree with that.

Yesterday we discussed two other great things about Suikoden:

It doesn't trivialise war. Each Suikoden game is about a big war but no one sees it as a trivial thing. Nanami longs to walk out of it. Tir leaves for a pastoral life as soon as the conflict is over. Cleo is tired of fighting and goes back to her house. Mathiu was reluctant to kill. All and every character has, deep inside, only one wish: for the war to be over and go back to a more fruitful life.
This makes their battle even more interesting, because they give everything they have for victory but with no hatred and no jubilation: they just want it to end as soon as possible.
It is also a much more realistic point of view. All and every war veteran I met in my life has shown reluctance to reminisce about it. My wife's granfather is viewed in her family as a hero for what he did in WWII but he always refused to talk about it himself: what we see as the time when he fought nazis, he sees it as these frightening years when he killed other young dudes. Deep inside, I know he is far more proud of what he did after the war: contributing to society, starting a nice family, being socially active, starting a business... At more than 80, this beats his war experience. I bet Suikoden characters would feel the same.

You fight for diversity. In contrast with the ranks of the Scarlet Moon Empire or the Highland Army, which shows a clean and neat horizon of uniformed guys, your own armies are full of different people. In both S1 and 2, you stand for several races and several social stratas. I won't underline the obvious, what with Kirkis and the kobolds, etc. But simply, what's in common between a rich merchant like Lepant and a scoundrel like Krin who wanted to steal his stuff in the first place? What does unite wanderers like Rina&Eilie with aristocrats like Vincent or a spoiled brat like Nina? They all fight together still. What you defend is a world where everyone has their place, against a monolithic society of grey uniforms.
The same goes for gender roles. Women in your side can go from the homely type like Yoshino and Helga to amazons like Oulan or Lorelai, passing by the clever yet humble Apple, the powerful yet absent-minded Viki, the seemingly perfect Jeane next to the tomboyish Nanami, none of them is an absolute model and yet each of them is. The message is: whatever kind of woman you want to be, there's a place for you here.
Same goes for men, the hypermasculine Viktor next to effeminated figures like Milich, there are cooks and engineers alike, Hix is full of doubts while Clive is hyperconfident, Tai Ho and Yam Koo are faithful buddies but Pesmerga is a loner, everything is possible here.
This feeling of a big, diverse, community, is a sweet utopia, it feels good to experience it when you play the game.

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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby Jocky » Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:30 pm

BrucePrintscreen wrote:My wife's granfather is viewed in her family as a hero for what he did in WWII but he always refused to talk about it himself: what we see as the time when he fought nazis, he sees it as these frightening years when he killed other young dudes. Deep inside, I know he is far more proud of what he did after the war: contributing to society, starting a nice family, being socially active, starting a business...

I understand what you mean here. Both my Grandfather and Great Grandfather (May they rest in peace. I love you Grumpa!) fought in WWII and neither of them ever spoke of the experiences they had during the war. My GG used to joke that he lost his middle finger in the war giving the finger to the Nazi's, but never once did he ever tell me how he actually lost it. And apart from mentioning that he was in a tank regiment he never spoke about what happened.
And I know that my Granddad ended up contracting Yellow fever and Typhoid and was hospitalized in a city, not far away from the British base he was stationed at near the German border sometime in 1944. While all the other soldiers around him in the infectious diseases ward died (This was pre-penicillin), he managed to cling on to life and was bed ridden for just over 8 months. When the doctors finally said he was fit enough to fly he was sent home and spent another 6 months in Dundee Royal Infirmary (Where he was given penicillin for the first time). He had spent 5 years fighting on the front lines to end up contracting a nearly fatal illness, which left him with scarred lungs for the rest of his days which eventually claimed him in later life. And to the day he passed he never once spoke of the things he'd done but you could tell from the way his eyes went when I asked (being a kid you're curious), that it haunted him, and was not something he was ever proud of.

To which my little tale brings me to the fact that, Suikoden never glamorizes war. All the characters strive to end it, as quickly as possible. The hero has to struggle with the fact that the longer the war goes on the more people will be hurt and killed, and this weighs heavy on them. I found this especially in 1, 2 and 5. All protagonists were fighting a loved one, be it father, best friend or younger sister, but knew that in order to make a difference to the diverse range of lives they were fighting FOR that it had to be done! But that's a lot of weight for 1 set of shoulders to bear. Which is why they are surrounded by so many loyal friends to help with that burden. I give credit to Konami for this! Because war is never meant to be fun, or easy and its understandable why the games end with them leaving. From what I've seen, after you've seen the bodies of friend and foe alike strewn on a battlefield, it's nearly impossible for you to have a 'normal' life afterwards.
For this I thank the older generation for what they did, in order to give us what we have now. Thank you.

Just another reason why I love the Suikoden games so much. Thanks Bruce!! Keep us informed of what the missus thinks of S2!! :)

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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby freshmetal » Mon Feb 03, 2014 8:55 pm

Sasarai10 wrote:
sticky-runes wrote:Pesmerga is basically the Boba Fett of Suikoden. He does F.A. but we're supposed to like him because he's got a cool helmet and we don't know much about him :roll:



Guess you belong to the minority :lol:


Many people get excited by the idea of using characters who wear unique clothes or armor such as Crowley or Pesmerga,rather than someone who wears some ordinary armor :mrgreen:



I guess I'm in the minority too. I don't have much of an opinion of Persmerga other than my own insane theories, but I do find Boba Fett EXTREMELY over-rated.

As for the actual topic, I wish I could get my wife into Suikoden. My wife sounds a lot like yours, Bruce. She's not a gamer at all, especially when it comes to RPGs. The only difference though is that I don't think there's any way on this Earth that I could ever convince her to play Suikoden. She's very stubborn like that, which I find shitty sometimes because I share a ton of her interest, but she want no part of mine. Oh, well. I guess the Suikodens are all MINE!!!
PSN: FreshMetal80

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sticky-runes
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Re: So, my wife is playing Suikoden...

Postby sticky-runes » Tue Feb 04, 2014 6:05 am

freshmetal wrote:
As for the actual topic, I wish I could get my wife into Suikoden. My wife sounds a lot like yours, Bruce. She's not a gamer at all, especially when it comes to RPGs. The only difference though is that I don't think there's any way on this Earth that I could ever convince her to play Suikoden. She's very stubborn like that, which I find shitty sometimes because I share a ton of her interest, but she want no part of mine. Oh, well. I guess the Suikodens are all MINE!!!


So Suikoden is your mistress :!:


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