Kyril = Flame Champion

Closed with the release.
Seltaeb
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Postby Seltaeb » Fri Jul 08, 2005 1:07 am

Earlier Angelis_Taleria said only Windy could have two true runes but why couldn't someone have a rune on each hand. I mean the Rune of Punishment is on the Hero 4's left hand while Ted's Souleater is on his right hand. So does it say anywhere why no one else but Windy can learn to use two true runes. Coudn't someone like the hero from Suikoden 4 whole survived the Rune of Punshment for so long posible find a way to either get rid of the Rune of Punishment and hide it away where no one could find it or learn to use two true runes. Im not going to use any stuipid ass lines like anything is posible.

Joveeno
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Postby Joveeno » Fri Jul 08, 2005 1:41 am

True and not true. Why would Hero4 release (more like letting go) his Rune of Punishment? He has already in the Forgiveness (or so, I forgot the phase) state. It shouldn't be a problem at all.

Another possibilities are, Kyril get the True Fire Rune, then giving it to someone else or seal it someway.

Anyway, did Konami ever state that True Fire Rune is only in Grasslands?

Angelis_Taleria
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Postby Angelis_Taleria » Fri Jul 08, 2005 2:03 am

The True Fire Rune was in the possession of Harmonia before the Flame Champion got it.

And, it's been stated that only Windy can have Two True Runes at the same time, although there is a Sindar technique to use runes in their crystal form a la' Sarah.
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Effect
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Postby Effect » Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:06 am

Look at it this way. Say that he could be the Flame Champion. He lived somewhere else and got a True Rune. He travels around, changes his looks over time or they change due to the run he's got or to the battles he gets in. Over time his personally changes and he starts using a staff instead and gets to the Grasslands. Due to past experience which could have been bad, he could decide that Grasslands were his new home and to make a fresh start, make up a new past for himself in that he grew up and was raised in the Grasslands if anyone asked.

Another reason to tie this end is that this wasn't thought up before Suikoden 3 and an inuniverse answer could be that it wasn't important at the time for him to explain who he really was, since to the situation and time, knowledge of his true past wasn't needed nor would have made a difference with so much time passing.

A person's personality can change on time, especially over the long time they've been alive with a True Rune. Look at Ted from Suikoden 4 and the version from Suikoden 1. Don't tell me he didn't change or that anyone else couldn't change or even lie about their past.

The problem is how he got the True Fire Rune. If he had another True Rune, why did he give it up or was it taken from him when he fouund the True Fire Rune since he most likely could only carry one. It could be applied to almost any character this way I think if done right.

That is if you wanted to make a connection. It could be done I feel without much trouble.

Seltaeb
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Postby Seltaeb » Mon Jul 11, 2005 12:31 pm

I agree with Effect completly. I was just wondering if it was posible that he sealed away the power of the Rune of Punishment. and that it in a way it made it so it didnt count as a true rune because it was inactive. and then he could have found the True Rune of Fire. I dont know how though.

Angelis_Taleria
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Postby Angelis_Taleria » Mon Jul 11, 2005 12:35 pm

But Effects theory only makes sense if we throw all of our Suiko-common sense out the window. I doubt Hero4 would seal up the rune since there is a slight possibility that someone could stumble upon it and unleash it's power.

Then again, even if we do that why would Hero4 risk breaking into Harmonia to get the True Fire Rune? Would it not be easier to simply regain the RoP that he sealed up?

There is no way that being in battles or a True Rune could change Hero4's physical characteristics so much that he looks like the FC. That's just crazy talk.
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Sovereign
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Postby Sovereign » Tue Jul 12, 2005 10:49 am

My glaring issue with Kyril being the FC is that there really isn't any

good reason for a character to switch weapons from an exotic bladed

weapon like Kyril's to a staff. I suppose he could be mult-talented, but it

seems pretty silly to imagine him just dropping one weapon proficiency

for another. I dont see how anyone thinks the 2 characters look even

remotely alike either.....

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Postby Joveeno » Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:12 am

Angelis_Taleria: I think you might be missing something...we're talking about Kyril, not Hero4...

Sovereign: But remember, the exotic blade Kyril use, is like a staff with blades in each end. So it's still possible changing weapon because it's of the same (or almost same) type.

Angelis_Taleria
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Postby Angelis_Taleria » Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:56 am

Joveeno wrote:Angelis_Taleria: I think you might be missing something...we're talking about Kyril, not Hero4...

Sovereign: But remember, the exotic blade Kyril use, is like a staff with blades in each end. So it's still possible changing weapon because it's of the same (or almost same) type.


Seltaeb made it sound as if you were talking about Hero4.


Even so, Kyril still can't be the Flame Champion due to the fact that he broke into Harmonia and got the True Fire Rune AFTER the firebringer was formed, if I do recall. Simply put, this Kyril = Flame Champion discussion is just as asanine as the whole 'Everyone who has black hair in SIII = Pesmerga LOLz' theory The gap in time is too large, Kyril and the Flame Champion look completely dissimilar, they use different weapons, the flame champion was born and raised in the grasslands(he has no reason to lie), and simply because two characters have similar traits DOES NOT make them the same person.
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Jowy Atreides
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Postby Jowy Atreides » Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:58 am

It would be the same as saying Futch from Suikoden III is actually Flik because they look alike, which is clearly not true.

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Arenegeth
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Postby Arenegeth » Thu Jul 14, 2005 7:52 pm

I don't believe that this is still going on, is rather unlikely people I don't say impossible just for the case of mathematical possibility but just forget about it, there is nothing to really suggest that, and remember judging by the cover Kiril hopefully will meet his end by the end of the game, but again that is just a rumbling based on the look of the cover, it may no happen.
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Postby Effect » Sun Jul 24, 2005 12:11 pm

I don't think it goes against common sense. Like said we're talking about the character from Rhapsodia, not Hero4 from Suikoden 4. That should have been made clearer.

How he could have got into Harmonia or why? There coudl be any number of reasons. He coud have came upon the ruin by pure accident, helped the Grasslands and into the fighting decided they needed extra help. The True Rune he might have had, might not have been enough. Or could have been captured, rune taken from him and as he escapes, he comes upon the True Fire Rune. He could have been a merc sent to steal it, etc.

There are a number of different ways of him getting ahold of it and losing the True Rune he might have held that would have allowed him to live as long as he did if we wanted to make a connection. True the Flam Champion would have no reaosn to lie but would he really have a reason to tell the truth. Granted this is just playing devils advocate here. Just saying that if they wanted to make an actual connection it could be done and it wouldn't really be that much of a problem I think.

Though, I'd rather if the two were differetn people and that seems to be the case but to say a connection couldn't be made is a little unfair I think.

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Postby Hxc Flavor » Sun Jul 24, 2005 12:39 pm

Historically it doesn't make any sense because the First Fire Bringer War was 50 years before Suikoden 3....... Suikoden 4 is set 150 years before Suikoden 1. Theres no way Kyril would be alive from Rhapsodia time to the Fire Bringer War time, since he got the True Fire Rune way later in life.
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Effect
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Postby Effect » Sun Jul 24, 2005 1:29 pm

Meaning he would have had to have another True Rune to be alive that long. Which is what was pointed out before. Meaning he'd have to lose that oen in order to get the True Fire Rune. If you wanted to make a connection I mean.

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Postby Angelis_Taleria » Sun Jul 24, 2005 3:19 pm

There is NO connection. This thread should've died 3 pages ago since there is no way that Kyril can be the Flame Champ.
I hope everything is going delicious.


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