Changing Companies After Suikoden IV?

A place to post news and also give your ideas about the future of the Suikoden series.
Please justify all speculations with reasons why you think such an event could happen.
Bright shield
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Post by Bright shield »

It's better Konami keeps hands on its child; rearing it themselves for it to grow up. You can sell the art, the plan, the plot for Suiko to some random shmoes. For a game though you can't just sell the persona of the developers to them thats what makes the game special. It makes it stand out amongst the designers.
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Hash
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Post by Hash »

SARSadmin wrote: As for the "Blue Moon Studio," the game is already being sold in Japan. It is called "Tsukiyo ni Saraba," and so far the reviews are not very good. Sales figures are very disappointing.
I am very happy about that. It may sound wrong, but... Take this, Murayama. You killed off Suikoden, now suffer professional failure the rest of your life. Yes, that's it.
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Eternal Rune
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Post by Eternal Rune »

i am quite convinced now that we shouldn't just keep our fingers crossed for the next installment to be a better one, i really think that we should do something about it. it may have never been succesful before (or done for that matter), but i guess if most of the fans started to send e-mails for konami or started to suggest certain things that could be added or replaced or even brought back would eventualy works... and i guess a way to do that isn't going to happen unless most of the fan sites of the series started to coordinate that effort together.

like suikosource & suikox, i heared there are some other fan-sites inside and outside of japan, and it makes sense that konami would listen to these fan-sites because they comprise the fans all together, wouldn't you think????????? :?
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Arenegeth
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Post by Arenegeth »

Not all fans have internet connections, but coordination on this front would be welcome.

I'm not happy that Murayama's game failed, but if that made a chance for him to return to Konami I could be happy.
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Shirofan
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Post by Shirofan »

If you actually take into account what people were whining about after Suikoden III, and how many of those were changed or removed in Suikoden IV then you can reach the conclusion that Konami did listen to what the fans were moaning about; albeit not their suggestions on how to put it right.

As with any title then you will find that people moan about the same things in general, but disagree on how they should be corrected; whereas some will actually prefer the way things are now anyway.

Fans do not have production deadlines; they do not need to convince people who fund projects; and they can discuss things on message boards to get a balanced opinion, whereas for legal reasons development staff tend to be placed more in a bubble.

By all means contact Konami, but if you do so make it short and focus on key areas. No-one is going to read a long diatribe on what you think is wrong and how it should be fixed.
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Ginzo
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Post by Ginzo »

We always seem to draw an arrow pointing derictly to Square-Enix when it comes to RPG games, forgeting the fact that S2's release on 1998-1999 clashed with the release of one of FF never-ending series.

And when it comes to Konami all we can think of are " Metal Gear " and the world record soccer series called " Winnign Eleven "

Why can't it be possible that Konami CAN do great RPG's ?

I know that the last two games - S3 & 4- where dissapointing to many fans , but the matter of fact remains that the ones behind the first two are different than those behind the later two, besides like Kawano said about the fact S4 is 150 years before S1 that she wanted an open enviroument not bounded by fact and conditions from the first three games. With that being said we come to relize that Konami is aiming for at least TEN more sequels to the game !!

And for ****** sake there has to be at least one game among those upcoming ten that's satisfying , right ?
RageRune
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Post by RageRune »

I am very happy about that. It may sound wrong, but... Take this, Murayama. You killed off Suikoden, now suffer professional failure the rest of your life. Yes, that's it.
I don't think Murayama can be pinpointed in "killing" the Suikoden series, it's mostly the staff who worked on SUikoden 4 to make Suiko4 such a bad game. I really do hope that Murayama goes back to Konami and resumes to work on the Suikoden series simply because her created the seires himself. I just don't see him working on any other games that's not a Suikoden.

And I would'nt say the Suikoden seires was "killed off", just because of one bad installment, it does'nt mean that the next installment will be bad or worse. Let's just hope that the staff working on the next Suikoden don't make the same mistakes from Suikoden 4.
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Eternal Rune
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Post by Eternal Rune »

murayama may have made a bad game, but i guess its because if you were good in something it is not a good idea to do different things,like, he was unbeatable in suikoden 1 & 2 when he introduced games that had so much in them that it will last forever, even though the graphics didn't really compete with final fantasy or other games at the time.. but who cares about graphics, it would be nice, but not on the expense of the games storyline and sidequests and most of all THE MYSTERIES INVOLVING SUIKODEN
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Post by Odehide »

Eternal Rune wrote:even though the graphics didn't really compete with final fantasy or other games at the time.. but who cares about graphics, it would be nice, but not on the expense of the games storyline and sidequests
This is something I've never grasped. I've always LOVED the pixle graphics that the Suikoden used (and I thought it looked much better than the FF7 bulky 3D characters in a drawn surrounding, at least Suikoden had some kind of unitiy to it's look), and quite frankly, was disappointed to see that they choose to go 3D at S3 at the time. Graphics are to me important in the way that it helps create the game's mood to a certain degree. But good graphics doesn't have to equal 3D graphics. At least not in my opinion. Although now I'm playing S4 (I never played S3 because I live in europe), and I'm pleased to see that the 3D thing works for them, they managed to keep the 'feel' of Suikoden. Although I'd say they might want to look into doing better running animation.
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Eternal Rune
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Post by Eternal Rune »

i've been reading through the suikox.com forum, and i came to realise something i think i already knew and it hit me.. konami isn't trying to ruin the series, it is trying to change suikoden for, what appears for them, a good reason.. and it is messing up the series because it isn't such a good idea. i mean, common, lets look back:

SUIKODEN III:
as good as it was like so many of you think (including me) it didn't really relate to the series that much because of things like: (different world map/different war system/MUCH diffrence in the battle system/the ******* trinity system/having the bad side as stars of destiny) and even though they were good, they changed the point of the seies for those who were fans before SIII and gave a wrong impression for the newer fans "and i know it is good, but SI's & SII's factors were better.........

SUIKODEN IV:
they clearly realized that what they did with suikoden III was a little damaging to the image we all have about the series, and they tried to bring back the suikoden we all knew before SIII, but i guess they didn't try hard enough.. they were on the right track but they missed some factors that are, even if little, crucial to revive suikoden, or so to speak, like: (a much more depth to the story/drama/developing the characters a bit more/playtime as it was a bit too short with not so much events)..

i do know that if thet tried to pull a SUIKODEN II it wouldn't work, not because the creativity is gone as it can't be gone in a series like suikoden, but because a DVD disc simply cannot hold that much graphics for so much towns and so much characters with so much animation for the runes and the cutscenes and all of that.i mean, if they tried to do a remake to suikoden I or II :idea: they would need at least 3 discs with so much going on in them, but why not?? look at shadow hearts 2.. it is pointless to argue about the importance of the graphics, because konami wouldn't agree to make a 2D just so they can add more details to the game because it is a set back and also because some fans DO LIKE a nice 3D enviroment i know i do, but at the end of the day i only wish they would keep an open mind when it comes for the suggestions of the fans because as i said before, WE ARE THE ONES THAT ARE PLAYING THE GAME so we should have a say in what is going on with them
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KoyuRedd
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Post by KoyuRedd »

Konami compressed the graphics and animation in Suikoden IV. I don't know if that's the actual case in III. They did it with I and II as well.
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Oppenheimer
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Post by Oppenheimer »

Eternal Rune wrote:/the ******* trinity system/
I liked the trinity system and the talking protagonist. Although I agree with you that they were trying to go back to the old style (silent protagonist). Some of the advances in Suiko III were for the better. I loved Suiko III, I don't know who was complaining about it. But if Suiko IV was the result of the complaining then they should have been quiet.
Aisling
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Changing companies

Post by Aisling »

Hello everybody.

Well, to be honest, I wouldn’t be happy if the Suikoden series were to be sold to, let’s say, Square Enix. I’m still a big fan of the Final Fantasy series (though my admiration started to decline, though very little by little, from the best seller Final Fantasy VII to the Final (disappointment) Fantasy X-2. But Final Fantasy is NOT Suikoden, and I think that what Suiko fans are looking for is to go beyond nice special effects and graphics.

Something that was a pleasant surprise for me was the continuity between Suikoden I and Suikoden II. Old characters that were well known and loved were back, together with their special old selves. Keeping that kind of continuity is not easy, and there are many cases when, for instance, writers, miss their mark.

One good example of this is in the Return of the Jedi Star Wars movie (I’m pretty sure you all have seen it). In the beginning of the movie, we find that Han Solo is calling Luke by his name, even tough he had addressed him “kid” in the first two movies (and it is not that their relationship had changed or that he was already acknowledging Luke as a more mature person; I don’t think you have time to ponder such deep questions when carbonite frozen). The screenwriter just plainly overlooked that fact.
Later on, we see Chewie getting everyone in trouble because he is “always thinking about his stomach” or so (though it is actually the VERY FIRST time that we see Chewie thinking about his stomach). The only time there was a continuity between Final Fantasies (X and X-2) the script was a complete mess.

I don’t really want to be overcritical about Square Enix, which are very good in their own field, but I would hate to see, for instance, Hugo turned into a Cloud-like psycho, or Flik being so worry about one simple-minded girl. Even tough they’re not bad at all, Square Enix plots and characters seem a little bland and whitered down (hope I’m using this word right) compared to the Suikoden series. Even the fourth game.

Oh, and by the way, I DID like Suiko IV. Maybe it was because I had read a lot of bad reviews before playing it and so when I could get it I was expecting it to be WORSE than it actually was. I was very surprised when the slow paced gameplay everybody was talking about did not happen to me, when I had no trouble sailing and when I actually started caring about the characters (specially Tal and Keneth; I started out an all-boys adventure and don’t regret it). Oh, the very vague (lots of unanswered questions) ending still makes me mad and upset, but I just left it to cool down.

I think that maybe I appreciated the fact that Suiko IV had this nice, old-fashioned feeling. Being now an old married lady (oh, yes, I became a Suikoden fan in my middle twenties, when the first game came out) I was just glad also to see that the game was easy (and short) enough so it wouldn’t take a lot of time I use for my job and my family.

You know, I just hated soooooo the “teen-ish” Final Fantasy X-2! And playing Final Fantasy XI online is just out of the question for me).
But well, this is just another opinion.

And, yes, if Suikoden I and II were to be remade, I’d most surely go out and purchase them right away!
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Flame_champz
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Post by Flame_champz »

You know why suikoden 3 and 4 wern't as great?

well heres why. people complained saying konami took to long to make games so they had 2 make em quick. I dont get it. True suikoden fans can wait for a suikoden game knowing that it will be good. so dont complain that they suck. Just freaking wait Konami has made probably my favourite RPG ever and suikoden 2 was the best. Fans want a new game and quick so wat do u know suikoden 3 comes out not as good as suikoden 2 but pretty good and then u were all like i want another so thay game you suikoden 4 which came out really quick and was no where near as good as suikoden 2. I would rather the game gets delayed by 2 years or sumting then play a game that is only 30 hours long. also WE WANT VIKTOR AND FLIK
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RageRune
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Post by RageRune »

Flame_champz wrote:You know why suikoden 3 and 4 wern't as great?

well heres why. people complained saying konami took to long to make games so they had 2 make em quick. I dont get it. True suikoden fans can wait for a suikoden game knowing that it will be good. so dont complain that they suck. Just freaking wait Konami has made probably my favourite RPG ever and suikoden 2 was the best. Fans want a new game and quick so wat do u know suikoden 3 comes out not as good as suikoden 2 but pretty good and then u were all like i want another so thay game you suikoden 4 which came out really quick and was no where near as good as suikoden 2. I would rather the game gets delayed by 2 years or sumting then play a game that is only 30 hours long. also WE WANT VIKTOR AND FLIK
I see what you're saying. When I heard Suiko4 was annmouced, I was like "WTF already!?!?", I think it was a year this game was annouced after Suiko3. I would'nt mind Konami taking it's time to make a Suiko installment either, it'll give the staff more time to develop the game right and fix things in the plot,gameplay,etc. Suikoden 4 really gave me that rushed, lazy feeling I've been getting from Final Fantasy lately.

Besides I have a ton of games that'll take up my time between Suiko installments. I 'm playing Shadow Hearts Covenant and Devil May Cry 3 right now and I'm having fun. :D
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