God, with a capital "G"

[Michael Easton]

First of all, why are y'all feeling so bad for him in the first place? Let the uneducated, ignorant, arrogant, foul-mouthed bastard go!

The idiot doesn't seem to know that he contradicts himself in his own defense! So good-bye fool, we don't need you!

Couldn't have put it better myself. I know what you mean by this guy contradicting himself, he doesn't make any sense. Also, I think it's hilarious that he tries to justify inbreeding:

and we're not all inbred hicks because of adam and eve. There came a point in time where god told man that inbreeding was no longer necessary and that it was a sin. So for the beginning of time, for population purposes, it was alright.

If I were your sister I'd be worried.

Anyway, Oppenheimer's right - " You should think for yourself, not rely on what someone else tells you". Unfortunately it seems that some people who do believe in God do not exercise this ability and instead prefer to be led by a book about how they should think or what they should believe.

My god "Monty Python and The Life of Brian" satirizes this point brilliantly; to quote it: "We're all individuals!" [IN UNISON]

EDIT: In light of the PM Crowley's Apprentice sent me I'm doubly pleased that he's gone. I'll not reprint it's contents here because of the foul language it contained. Clearly he couldn't tell I was joking about the in-breeding thing.

[27x4=108]

everybody has his brain, and his opinions

in science ( knowed ) we could say, "X man has discovered and proved that, ure wrong", but things like why a gay is gay arent knowed now, al lot of things of brain and behaviour are unknown.. basing science in a book its just funny

but as i said, this is a "fe" post, anyone believes in what he wants, a force that creates all, well, we could talk about it, but nobody can say my opinions are wrong, we can only compare opinions, if ure basing ur opinion in a book and a religion, u have no opinion...

believing in pink-giant-bees as god is not a wrong idea, its a opinion, maybe sounds crazy, but u can do nothing

posts like this didnt help, are useles, u can convince someone of some unjustified theory of suikoden, but of god? or whats a sin or not?, etc etc, no way

[Raging Barows Brat]

As I am gay I took Crowley's points personally, thus I responded attacking him personally.

I actually wasn’t referring to your post, Op. This thread got way nasty long before your post. I realize you were just responding to what was already a hateful atmosphere. I was vague because I didn’t want to seem like I was attacking anyone in particular. I know how sensitive some people can be, thinking they’re being ‘persecuted’ and whatnot. I just hate it when things get reduced to name-calling, as Eroschilles said. But I understand how it got that way. I am actually very much in agreement with you and Pollen on the homosexual issue.

I have faith because I choose to have faith, because Christ’s teachings happen to be consistent with my attitudes anyway. His actual teachings, not the homophobic garbage some unfortunate people use the religion to justify. I’ve just been trying to clarify that those who do preach tirades against homosexuality are wrong and not behaving as true Christians should. Such behavior is anti-Christian and ignorant. That’s the gist of my whole argument.

I can certainly think for myself. I just happen to be an educated person who chooses to have faith. It just really pisses me off when people use my faith to preach hatred, because they are grossly misrepresenting the faith. So I always have to jump in and clarify just to point out that such an attitude is actually anathema to real Christian values.


Michael Easton: That is one of my all-time favorite movies. Your mere mention of it brightened my day.

[Eroschilles]

Yeah, I was pretty much under the assumption that Christianity was a cult. Not to offend anyone out there, but that's the way I thought it was. Though I guess technically it's not.

I just figured that any off-shot religion, such as Christianity came from Judism, that made up there own bible was a cult. And the way alot of fanatics out there of Christianity spout such hateful things while saying 'love thy neighbour' has always confused me.

I've been told that I'm not really a Christian because some of my beliefs. But I do believe in Jesus, I just don't live my life for him or anything. I live my life according to my own moral code and doing what I feel is right. Not because a dusty old book or hoping to get God-brownie points to get into heaven.

[Fu Su Lu]

I can not avoid to get annoyed by this once and again. This a suikoden forum, suikoden is about recruiting different people(skin, ideology, long etc...) from diferent countries etc etc. And everytime homosexuality pops up some guys appear and say odd things about gays. (Off topic: I also know of some people that talk very bad about gays and then... well lets say that the opposite sex is not between their preferences )


If Crowley leaves it will be at least the second one who leaves (I assume Son Michael left) by this discussion. You can not expect say such awful things, expect no answer and when the answer come get angry. That is rather childish.

You can not judge a person by skin, good or bad looking, or sexuality. Brother, I talk to so many diferent people during my job. Sometimes is worthier listen to a homeless than a person in armani suit, briefly said.
I have gay friends and relatives (but I like women )
and cant believe some of the thing about gays that have been written here, some of those things are not opinion but insult or worse, racism (change the word gay for whitie, black or jew and you will see what i mean).

I think discussion can be kept inside the limits of respecting each other whatever is your point of view. Dont say 'Gay is sin'. Hell, altough i think any religion is a cult and fits the description, it is only my opinion.

[Red Killey]

I'm actually just wondering why the title of this thread is about God, but the discussion seems to be about Homosexuality instead. Oh well. Carry on, as long as peace is kept. I've banned Crowley's Apprentice for personal attack.

Having different opinion is fine, but don't attack the others. ^^

[Iku]

getting back on the topic of god i think oppie brought up a good piont like him i see myself as a good person and i do good deeds yet i dont have a faith, does this mean that if there is a heaven i wont go to it because as martin luthur ( not king) said that it doesnt matter about your deeds as long as you believe meaning there is no chance that non believers can not go to heaven! but it could be said the good deeds of nonbelievers out weigh those of believers as they are done out of the goodness of their hearts rather then fear of retribution!

[Iris]

Well, as far as the God I believe in goes, I don't think He would care much so long as you're a good person. Yeah, definite points to believers, but if, say, a nonbeliever gave to charity, took care of orphans, fed kittens, et cetera and was generally a good person, I can't see why He wouldn't let them into Heaven.

I agree with Iku- I don't see why the good deeds of nonbelievers can't outweigh those of believers. I can't really see the point in point in believing in a God that wants everyone to love and be nice if A) you're being an intolerant jerk and B) you just worship God because being struck be lightning isn't a very plesant experience.

[modi]

i guess has gone a lot away from what it was first meant to be , since it was meant to talk about God not gays.
besides if anyone has any problem with gays , deal with your problem , if you don't like gays avoid them , you think that they are wrong being gay and should be straight prove it to them , you hate them , it's your problem keep it to yourself or justify yourself though in the end you'll find yourself wrong .
about crowley , someone who was narrow minded and couldn't justify himself and keep a civilized discussion , thus it turned against him , so everyone say good bye to our loving clever crowley

of course about ending the disscusion about gays you can continue it and just ignore what i said , and i apologize if i said something that offended you or stupid

[Pollensalta]

I still have a lot of unanswered questions for those who are Christians and don't take it too far. I've mentioned them in some previous posts but never really got a straight answer.

Mainly I want to hear a Christian's thoughts on the book of Job, and how God could play a game like that with someone's life if he truly loved that person and that person was a true believer.

And how God can be a loving god, a jealous god, and an angry god at the same time. (All 3 are stated in the Bible.)

Or how there can be 4 gospels, each telling stories in a different way with different facts (therefore making 3 of those gospels incorrect by default, and if those gospels are incorrect, then who is to say the rest of the Bible isn't?)

These are serious questions that I would like an answer to.

[Iku]

i cant really answer your other questions but the book of job is seen to be more of a parable then of true events so a Christian would argue that god didn't play a game with the devil it was merely the author's way of explaining innocent suffering. but there is oner major flaw with the story as in the end job gets everything back but his children are still dead, yes he does get new ones but their children not barns and goats ( though i do like goats! )

[Eroschilles]

I still have a lot of unanswered questions for those who are Christians and don't take it too far. I've mentioned them in some previous posts but never really got a straight answer.

Mainly I want to hear a Christian's thoughts on the book of Job, and how God could play a game like that with someone's life if he truly loved that person and that person was a true believer.

And how God can be a loving god, a jealous god, and an angry god at the same time. (All 3 are stated in the Bible.)

Or how there can be 4 gospels, each telling stories in a different way with different facts (therefore making 3 of those gospels incorrect by default, and if those gospels are incorrect, then who is to say the rest of the Bible isn't?)

These are serious questions that I would like an answer to.

These questions are easy enough.

The reason a supposedly loving, just, jealous, and angry God exists is because He is all of those things. He screwed with Job because He wanted to prove to Lucifer that He could still be loved even when He really messes up people's lives. And He was proven wrong. Eventually Job gets so distraught why God would kill his entire family, put plagues upon him, take away all he owned, and ruin his life that he curses God. Then God realizes He was a dillweed and apologizes to Job. That's why I wonder why lots of Christians say God is infalible. He admits to his mistakes. So God is an asshole. Throughout the bible He makes a transition like any dynamic character does. He goes from very fiery to sacrificing his only son. So, the Lord is a complex figure. It doesn't mean I have any less love for Him or less faith. He would put so many things worth enjoying if He was a total dillweed. At least that's my opinion.

As for the Gospels, like all the other booksof the bible. They are written by men. And men are screwups so they don't know alot of things. So they make it up. Some of the stories in the Gospels are made up. I wouldn't know which ones because I wasn't there. But there are even more sciptural text that wasn't included in the bible that may be useful as nifty stories. The main point of the Gospels is to get Jesus' message across. They don't give much as to Jesus' life because tehy didn't know. The story of his birth is more to match up older scriptures predicting the Messiah. In order to get His message out they had to convince people that He was the savior for mankind. I don't doubt the virgin birth or the miracles He performed. i just don't take all the stories as literal. that would be crazy. Some would argue that would be faith. That would be blind faith. I think Jesus would want us to see and think for ourselves, but to have faith in the areas that we don't understand. Not to have faith in inane things.

So because there are errors or contradictions between the books doesn't make the whole book/s wrong. To me the bible is like a little guide to give you basic information. The rest is a spiritual journey that one must take throughout their life. I believe God loves us all the same as long as we come out as good people. Don't have to be Christian people, but people who do good and live a just life. Whether they pray to a frog for protection or God or Allah.

But I don't think God is the source of all misfortune either. There is chance in the universe. I least that's what i think.

[Pollensalta]

And yet God is supposed to be perfect and sinless, which is a huge contradiction to what you just said...?

[Jowy Atreides]

And yet God is supposed to be perfect and sinless, which is a huge contradiction to what you just said...?

Were these attributes added on at a later time, or are they actually present in the Bible?

[Eroschilles]

And yet God is supposed to be perfect and sinless, which is a huge contradiction to what you just said...?

As Jowy said above it's been more or less assumed by Judeo-Christian religious peoples. God tells Moses that He is a jealous god. But jealousy is supposed to be a sin. Envy and all. So, I don't think God himself claims to be perfect. But He is perfectly honest.

But then I'm not a goood representation of the majority of Christians. So I try not to contradict myself too often.