Windy and Suikoden 3

In-Depth topics that fail to give reasons for their hypotheses.
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727
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I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby 727 » Wed Mar 21, 2012 10:37 am

''This is one of the techniques I learned from my mentor. It connects this world with another one. I need to use it, because it is becoming difficult to deploy the army.''

-Luc, Suikoden 3, Geddoe Chapter 5

First we know that Leknaat doesn't have the power to create an army of monsters. We also know from Suikoden 1 that Windy is the first person to learn how to bear more than one True Rune. Logic points us to SuikoRoku Gaiden's theory.

FROM SUIKOSOURCE

Gate Rune -
''A True Rune with the power to connect worlds, this rune holds great powers. The Blue Gate Rune was born from this rune. Belonging to the Gate Rune Clan, this rune has been protected for centuries. However, the clan was destroyed by invading Harmonians in Solis 78. The two sisters, Windy (Gate Rune - Front) and Leknaat (Gate Rune - Back) (In the Gate Rune Clan, all members were considered siblings), separated the Gate Rune into two halves and teleported away.

I made a non-profit video game that demonstrates my theory of what took place between Suikoden II and III. It's only about an hour but I think it gives a great idea on a very possible scenario.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/SuikoRoku ... 3649544482
Last edited by 727 on Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:31 pm, edited 5 times in total.
A brand new Suikoden game with a well-written script!

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Suikorok ... ?ref=br_tf

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Hirathien
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby Hirathien » Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:12 am

That's... Not proof at all. You got no evidence, only theories based on a single line of text.

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727
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby 727 » Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:24 pm

It doesn't matter how many lines it is, it's written crystal clear. That is what writers call foreshadowing. There's no other way to interpret that than for it to be Windy. It's a very subtle way to put it out there without saying it in blunt words, foreshadowing.

1-Luc uses the same power as Windy, the only person capable of creating an army of illusions.
2-Yuber has always served Windy
3-He mentions a mentor teaching him a power and Leknaat never created monsters.
4-Windy is the evil half of the Gate Rune so why wouldn't he change mentors when he changed?
5-Luc goes inside and betrays Harmonia; Windy has a passion to destroy Harmonia.

All of this evidence suggests by WHAT THEY SAY in the actual game that Windy is in fact the one who made Luc change the way he sees.

Play my game to get a better understanding. it's available on the game's facebook page.

-link deleted, putting this up multiple times is akin to advertising - Op
A brand new Suikoden game with a well-written script!

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Suikorok ... ?ref=br_tf

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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby Antimatzist » Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:55 pm

1. I haven't played 3 for some time, but isn't it Sarah who summons the monsters?
2. Yuber served Windy once and after that, never again afawk.
3. Still she has basically the same rune as Windy, so my guess is that she's able to summon monsters, too. This is merely speculation.
4. There is no evil half of the Gate Rune.
5. So what? It is never even implied that Luc changed his mentor. I dont think we know when he left Leknaat,but the thing that changed his views were the True Wind Rune itself.

I played the game and it really answers nothing. I mjst say you improved a bit, but it's just... ok, let me tell you this. You seem to have your vision for a great story. Then write a story. But you have really NO ability to make a good game, even with the newest RPG Maker. Unless you find someone who makes the game for you, please, don't do it. Write a fanfiction, but these games are just a pain to play.

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727
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby 727 » Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:51 pm

You haven't even played it and you remain a complete pessimist.

Calling this an unjustified theory? Then what else would that quote mean? It's obviously foreshadowing.

Sarah wasn't even there. And who would of taught her to use Windy's Rune?

What we know from the TRUE GATE RUNE.

IT'S THE ONLY RUNE TO CONNECT TWO WORLDS.

HE LITERALLY SAYS ''IT CONNECTS THIS WORLD WITH ANOTHER.''

That means he referenced Windy at the very least, and used Mentor as a descriptive sentence. This isn't unjustified at all. Anyone with a deep understanding of the lore realizes that Suikoden III posed several unanswered mysteries while giving clues, clues like this, that you just say NO and ignore.

Also, play my new game before you decide anything! I've learned a lot since my first game.

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EstrangedIX
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby EstrangedIX » Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:27 pm

Personally, I believe that the story changed at some point (probably having to do with Murayama leaving) and that there are leftover fragments from prior to the change. Sarah has Gate skill, but a Flowing rune stuck in her head that she just happened to be born with. That in and of itself wouldn't be too weird considering others' unuseable skills, but she uses Gate spells at the end of the game even though there's no rune on her for that. This might suggest that she was meant to have inherited Windy's Gate Rune and then changes were made that gave her a random Flowing rune instead. Or not, because unless someone official confirms this then there's nothing to do but speculate. But if that is the case, Luc's quote may also be a leftover fragment. It could also be another of the many mistranslations that the series has.

Also, we only know of Yuber working with Windy twice: Ted's village and the Gate Rune War. No telling what he did in the meantime.

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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby Antimatzist » Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:51 pm

I don't think you need Windys part of the Gate Rune to summon monsters (or at least it's not mandatory). There are some examples in which people summon beings from other worlds (e.g. Warlock summoning the Tree).

I played your demo, it's just that it's still no fun.

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Raww Le Klueze
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby Raww Le Klueze » Wed Mar 21, 2012 6:06 pm

Obviously his mentor is Warlock then. Now that's foreshadowing.

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727
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby 727 » Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:09 am

It has a good story and you discredit it because the production values aren't insane. To each their own, not everyone wants to play a SNES version of Suikoden no matter how unique the story. Plus the fact that
my game's story is almost nothing but foreshadowing.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/SuikoRoku ... 482?ref=ts
(Download it here, it's only an hour and worth a play just for the story)


OBVIOUSLY, Windy influenced Luc somewhere along the way.

Look at it with logic!

USE WHAT YOU KNOW to know what you don't!

He says ''connects this world with another, Luc uses the gate rune power''

When using it for the first time seen in the game he references a ''Mentor''

He's using the Gate Rune that he learned about from his Mentor.

Who could his mentor be?

Leknaat? Of course not.

Let's think about his goals. Destroying a True Rune and destroying the continent... Harmonia. The whole games about Harmonia and he betrays Harmonia.

Who did we first learn about Harmonia from? Windy! She was attacked by Harmonia when she was a child. Her entire goal is to gather the True Runes just like Hikasuuk. She is his most bitter rival.

Let's add this together.

Gate Rune directly mentioned
Mentor directly mentioned
Destroying Harmonia mentioned
Hikasuuk's intent to collect True Runes mentioned
Windy's intent to collect True Runes previously mentioned

Add this together and we have more than a theory. We have the direction the story was supposed to go in but they decided to go backwards instead.

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727
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Windy and Suikoden 3

Postby 727 » Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:18 am

I refuse to accept this as unjustified when it's mentioned at a precise moment near the climax, just as Luc's entire plan begins to be fully revealed.

I didn't make up this quote and to ignore it is pure ignorance.

''This is one of the techniques I learned from my mentor. It connects this world with another one. I need to use it, because it is becoming difficult to deploy the army.''

OBVIOUSLY, Windy influenced Luc somewhere along the way.

Look at it with logic!

USE WHAT YOU KNOW to know what you don't!

He says ''connects this world with another, Luc uses the gate rune power''

When using it for the first time seen in the game he references a ''Mentor''

He's using the Gate Rune that he learned about from his Mentor.

Who could his mentor be?

Leknaat? Of course not.

Let's think about his goals. Destroying a True Rune and destroying the continent... Harmonia. The whole games about Harmonia and he betrays Harmonia.

Who did we first learn about Harmonia from? Windy! She was attacked by Harmonia when she was a child. Her entire goal is to gather the True Runes just like Hikasuuk. She is his most bitter rival and wants to use the True Runes to defeat him.

Let's add this together.

Gate Rune directly mentioned
Mentor directly mentioned
Destroying Harmonia mentioned
Hikasuuk's intent to collect True Runes mentioned
Windy's intent to collect True Runes previously mentioned

Add this together and we have more than a theory. We have the direction the story was supposed to go in but they decided to go backwards instead.

-link deleted, putting this up multiple times is akin to advertising - Op
A brand new Suikoden game with a well-written script!

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Suikorok ... ?ref=br_tf

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Hirathien
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby Hirathien » Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:42 am

But Leknaat was his mentor, for several years...

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Raww Le Klueze
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Re: Windy and Suikoden 3

Postby Raww Le Klueze » Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:13 pm

logic

You keep using that word... I do not think it means what you think it means.

Also, we generally kind of frown upon making the same topic twice, also on making topics just to thinly advertise something.
Doctorum Non Urina Singulus.

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Raww Le Klueze
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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby Raww Le Klueze » Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:24 pm

Leknaat also sends Windy's army back through the gate, to assume that she knows how to close the door but not open it is rather silly. They're both from the Gate Rune Clan, both possess half of the Gate Rune, it's a fair bet that they both know a whole deal about gate magic. The fact that we never see Leknaat summon an army of mindless monsters doesn't mean she can't do it, and what reason would she have to? By this logic no one ever goes to the bathroom in Suikoden cause it's never shown.

And no, we didn't learn about Harmonia from Windy. Harmonia isn't mentioned a single time in Suikoden I. Furthermore, Luc isn't going to destroy Harmonia, he's destroying the Grasslands and part of Harmonia, mostly it's Grasslands that get the raw end of the deal.

You're grasping at straws that aren't even there. Luc learned how to summon from Leknaat, there's no hidden mystery.

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Re: I found proof that Windy is related to Suikoden III

Postby Antimatzist » Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:54 pm

And I'm pretty sure Luc was introduced to Harmonia because he was "born" there. Didn't he get freed by Leknaat? Also, he journeys at least once to Harmonia to save Sarah. And he fights Harmonia in Suikoden II.

And yeah, he studied with Leknaat for several years and she also possesses a Gate Rune and maybe she teaches him some techniques, too. You can't say she doesn't possess these skills, just because she doesn't show them, I think it's safe to assume she has a similar skill set as Windy.

Don't get me wrong, it's fan-fic etc and that's ok, but if a lot of people tell you what's wrong with your theories and you don't listen, that's just.. not cool.

And if you choose to make a game to perform your ideas, and the idea is flawed and no fun, that poses a serious problem. I can name some problems with the gameplay itself if you want.

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727
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Re: Windy and Suikoden 3

Postby 727 » Fri Mar 23, 2012 3:11 pm

It's you the ones who aren't listening. You're not even reading the quote.

What else could that mean?

Why would Leknaat teach him how to use the Gate Rune? Leknaat isn't even capable of using more than one True Rune. The first person to bear more than one was Windy.

There's no way he even knows how to collect True Runes without meeting Windy. He's obviously referencing Windy.


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