Multiple unique runes ~formerly:Is it possible?

Hypothesis for, and analyses of, the various locations and backstory of the Suikoden world.
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Multiple unique runes ~formerly:Is it possible?

Postby Runemaster » Sat May 24, 2008 5:47 am

Just came out of my ever-so-mystified mind.

Since "bearing" two or more True runes is impossible, is it possible for a Suikoden character to have:

H-- Back Gate Rune
Rh-- Bright Shield Rune
Lh-- Rune of Punishment

Weapon:
*double swords*
Dragon King Sword & Star Dragon Sword

I know it's a weird example, but I think It'd represent all the other Runes that can fit the above Runes' positions.

It's possible, isn't it?

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Last edited by Runemaster on Sun May 25, 2008 11:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Lovecraft_elder » Sat May 24, 2008 9:06 am

No. A person can only carry one True Rune at the time, however, Windy claimed to have found a method to carry more. Perhaps a person could carry two weapons embedded with True Runes, however, I don't thinkt the True Runes would allow (especially not the Zodiac Sword aka. Star Dragon Sword).

In my opinion, the answer is a simple no, unless that person somehow acquire the knowledge that Windy possesed.
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Mikain Clan King » Sat May 24, 2008 12:19 pm

Runemaster wrote:
H-- Back Gate Rune
Rh-- Bright Shield Rune
Lh-- Rune of Punishment


Remember the Bright shield and Back gate are not true runes, just pieces...so that right there should be possible...and maybe your body/spirit couldn't handle more than 1 true rune....and maybe thats what Windy found how to break, lol maybe you have to commit suicide with some ritual and you will stay in spirit, have the power of the runes, but not be human...Hmmm not-human...Jeane?
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby JanusThePaladin » Sat May 24, 2008 1:07 pm

Runemaster wrote:Just came out of my ever-so-mystified mind.

Since "bearing" two or more runes is impossible, is it possible for a Suikoden character to have:

H-- Back Gate Rune
Rh-- Bright Shield Rune
Lh-- Rune of Punishment

Weapon:
*double swords*
Dragon King Sword & Star Dragon Sword

I know it's a weird example, but I think It'd represent all the other Runes that can fit the above Runes' positions.

It's possible, isn't it?


I dont see why not. As stated before the Back Gate and Bright Shield runes are both partial runes, not whole true runes, so the "only one true rune" rule shouldnt apply. However, Windy only had her half of a Gate Rune, but seemed unable to possess more than one True Rune (til she found the secret). So its possible that that rule applies to all True Runes, partial or no, as we're made to believe so in S1.

But if it were possible, i'd still find it unlikely, as True Runes (and partial True Runes) choose their bearers. it seems far from likely that 5 different Runes would all choose the same guy.

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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Runemaster » Sat May 24, 2008 10:10 pm

Oh yeah, they choose their bearers.

How about the swords?

Does the Dragon King Sword talk? If it does, it would be nice how the two swords have their conversation-- or should I say quarrel.
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby JanusThePaladin » Sun May 25, 2008 1:45 am

I dont know that the Dragon King Sword is the Soveriegn Rune. If i remember correctly, the Rune was simply imbedded in the blade. I do believe that it is possible to force a true rune into an inanimate object, as the Blights did with the Beast Rune (until Luca unleashed it) or how Genkaku and Han removed the halves of the rune of beginning and placed them in the altar.

Just a thought.

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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Mio » Sun May 25, 2008 12:42 pm

well if it would help your imagination; runes are but a symbol, like a letter or a shape

the magic is embedded on that symbol

and wherever that symbol gets imprinted, its power is also transported along with it

and its logical to think that if you attach the rune to anything, as long as you can find a way to channel its power, it is possible to make any object, place, or creature to be infected by the rune

(explain the beast rune on floor and runes on weapons and pedestals)

now about the Star Dragon Sword, its about the only rune that can talk, at least to the level that we humans do

if i would place a bet, that sword is a mix of the Night Rune and its past bearer

now that makes sense to me (thats only me though)

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Re: Is it possible?

Postby LanceHeart » Sun May 25, 2008 7:30 pm

The original combination is absolutely possible. Seeing it actually happen in-game would almost be impossible story-wise, though.

As for the Sovereign Rune, it being embedded into the Dragon King Sword is likely the vessel that contains it being embedded into the sword, not the "rune" itself. The sword itself isn't an incarnation of the rune (unlike the Star Dragon Sword) and we already know that True Runes can be contained.

As for the Star Dragon Sword, I'm sure it's not the only True Rune that can talk. However, it's likely the only one who WANTS to talk. Others just prefer telepathy or astral projection to communicate.
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Mikain Clan King » Sun May 25, 2008 8:57 pm

Mio wrote:well if it would help your imagination; runes are but a symbol, like a letter or a shape

the magic is embedded on that symbol

and wherever that symbol gets imprinted, its power is also transported along with it

and its logical to think that if you attach the rune to anything, as long as you can find a way to channel its power, it is possible to make any object, place, or creature to be infected by the rune

(explain the beast rune on floor and runes on weapons and pedestals)

now about the Star Dragon Sword, its about the only rune that can talk, at least to the level that we humans do

if i would place a bet, that sword is a mix of the Night Rune and its past bearer

now that makes sense to me (thats only me though)

That makes alot of sense, clears things up and helps alot...good job on the post.
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Lovecraft_elder » Fri May 30, 2008 5:40 pm

I dont see why not. As stated before the Back Gate and Bright Shield runes are both partial runes, not whole true runes, so the "only one true rune" rule shouldnt apply. However, Windy only had her half of a Gate Rune, but seemed unable to possess more than one True Rune (til she found the secret). So its possible that that rule applies to all True Runes, partial or no, as we're made to believe so in S1.


Well, the Front Gate Rune and the Back Gate Rune are, I believe, one True Rune each. I think Konami stated that along time ago, but I could be wrong. Never the less, the 27 True Runes aren't chosen by a bearer, they choose their bearer themselves... more or less. In SI, the Rune of Life and Death chose Tir. In SII, they call it destiny (and Riou is the "son" of Genkaku, the former bearer). In SVI, the Punishment Rune takes Lazlo as its host, and even the Dawn Rune chooses to free itself from its bust to be with Freyadour. My point is that it doesn't seem logical that any True Rune would ever compromise with another, and thereby share the same host.

No one that we know of have ever been able to host more than one True Rune, the one that is closest (SPOILER!!!) is Hikusaak, having created a couple of clones of himself that carries the True Runes for him.

It seems illogical that no one in the Suikoden universe hasn't tried to carry more than one True Rune, if it was so easy. I mean, with such great magicians as Jeane, Luc, Windy and even Leknaat - one of them must have had the chance (Even though I'd like to see Leknaat stealing the Bright Shield Rune and the Black Sword Rune right before Riou and Jowy : P ).
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby JanusThePaladin » Sat May 31, 2008 3:51 am

Lovecraft_elder wrote:

It seems illogical that no one in the Suikoden universe hasn't tried to carry more than one True Rune, if it was so easy. I mean, with such great magicians as Jeane, Luc, Windy and even Leknaat - one of them must have had the chance (Even though I'd like to see Leknaat stealing the Bright Shield Rune and the Black Sword Rune right before Riou and Jowy : P ).


Wasnt the major premise of Suikoden 1 that Windy had discovered a way to bear more than 1 true rune? and didnt (SPOILER)

The soul eater reject her

(/SPOILER)?

I think it would be interesting to see, and completely logical btw, someone, maybe Lym bearing the Sun, Dawn, and Twilight runes.

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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Lovecraft_elder » Sat May 31, 2008 6:39 am

You can carry the Sun Rune along with the Dawn Rune and the Twillight Rune, since the Dawn Rune and Twillight Rune aren't True Runes.
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Jowy Atreides » Sat May 31, 2008 7:17 am

Yeah, it's the only way you can avoid going insane (bearing all three runes at the same time).

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Re: Is it possible?

Postby Runemaster » Sat May 31, 2008 7:49 am

Jowy Atreides wrote:Yeah, it's the only way you can avoid going insane (bearing all three runes at the same time).


I didn't know that! o0o0o0o0o0ohhhh.......

Then somebody, specifically the Queen, must've borne the three before EVERYTHING happened!!! There's nothing wrong with it, right...???????
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Re: Is it possible?

Postby LanceHeart » Sat May 31, 2008 9:50 am

Lovecraft_elder wrote:Well, the Front Gate Rune and the Back Gate Rune are, I believe, one True Rune each. I think Konami stated that along time ago, but I could be wrong. Never the less, the 27 True Runes aren't chosen by a bearer, they choose their bearer themselves... more or less. In SI, the Rune of Life and Death chose Tir. In SII, they call it destiny (and Riou is the "son" of Genkaku, the former bearer). In SVI, the Punishment Rune takes Lazlo as its host, and even the Dawn Rune chooses to free itself from its bust to be with Freyadour. My point is that it doesn't seem logical that any True Rune would ever compromise with another, and thereby share the same host.

The Front Gate and Back Gate Runes are in fact two separate parts of the rune, much in the same way the Black Sword and Bright Shield runes are halves of the Rune of Beginning. Even Leknaat explicitly says that she split the actual True Rune with Windy. Were they both True Runes, that would mean there would be 28 True Runes in the world instead of 27, due to one True Rune basically becoming two new ones.

As for the Dawn Rune, it's been stated before that it's in fact a Unique Rune, alongside the Twilight Rune. As stated above, they're both the balancing runes needed in order to control the volatile effects of the Sun Rune (insanity, or rather losing your mind to the rune's will).

Lovecraft_elder wrote:It seems illogical that no one in the Suikoden universe hasn't tried to carry more than one True Rune, if it was so easy. I mean, with such great magicians as Jeane, Luc, Windy and even Leknaat - one of them must have had the chance (Even though I'd like to see Leknaat stealing the Bright Shield Rune and the Black Sword Rune right before Riou and Jowy : P ).

The Gate Rune War started because Windy wanted the Soul Eater when she found Ted. The part where the Soul Eater refuses to join with Windy is mostly because the Rune decided not to, rather than refusing due to Windy having a True Rune.

Come to think of it, her method of wielding more than one True Rune probably stems from her splitting the rune, thus making the parts able to coexist within one person.
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