Bright Shield and Black Sword

kenobi · Post by **kenobi** » Sun Feb 27, 2005 10:34 pm

not a true rune eh...well anything goes then..

about the old book..how can they just ignore a thing such as that..by the end of suiko2..they won the war..shouldn't they clear things out on who started it all?

Kranach · Post by **Kranach** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 3:50 am

Well in Suikoden2 the description of Bright Shield and Black Sword is one of the27 true runes, while the Soul Eater says 1 of the 27 true runes. And if the Bright Shield is not a true rune then why was there a shield rune in Suikoden3?

demon eye · Post by **demon eye** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 8:36 am

Neither the Bright Shield or Black Sword are True Runes separate, but together they form the Rune of Beginning. As for the shield rune question, it's possible that it is a descendant of the Rune of Beginning and not the Bright Shield Rune. I mean, have we seen a Sword Rune, yet? Therfeore, we can't assume the shield comes from the Bright Shield eventhough it's rather likely.

But, it's possible that the Shield Rune is from the Rune of Beginning and not the Bright Shield itself. Eventhough, the Bright Shield Rune is not a True Rune by itself, it is still a component of a True Rune therefore making it a special rune aside from the normal rune hierarchy. Therefore, it is very possible for it to give birth to descending runes, as well.

kenobi · Post by **kenobi** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:56 pm

the shield rune from suiko3 is surely to be born of the rune of beginning.the rune of beginning is the black sword and bright shield right?i'm quite sure that somewhere in the suiko world there is a sword rune too.let just say that the sword and the shield are born from the rune of beginning.

The Black Knight · Post by **The Black Knight** » Tue Mar 01, 2005 10:13 pm

I think the Sword of magic runes are born from the sword runes but im not sure.

kenobi · Post by **kenobi** » Thu Mar 03, 2005 12:32 am

The Black Knight wrote:I think the Sword of magic runes are born from the sword runes but im not sure.

the sword of magic are more likely to be born from the elemental runes..it's the same as embedding a rune on your weapon in suiko2 style..

son_michael · Post by **son_michael** » Thu Mar 03, 2005 1:56 am

in suikoden 3 if youve uploaded suikoden 2 data and place edge in neclords play, edge will say how amazed he is that the story got so twisted{i forgot the exact words he uses} so I think the people in suikoden 3 deffinetley heard a different story about 2,edge is living proof because he was there

Angelis_Taleria · Post by **Angelis_Taleria** » Thu Mar 03, 2005 9:11 pm

Kranach wrote:Well in Suikoden2 the description of Bright Shield and Black Sword is one of the27 true runes, while the Soul Eater says 1 of the 27 true runes. And if the Bright Shield is not a true rune then why was there a shield rune in Suikoden3?

It can be thought of like this

Shield rune could be a first tier rune, Bright Shield being a mid-tier rune, and Rune of beginning being the rune that spawns them both, but unlike other cases (True Fire > Rage > Fire) there is only one Mid Tier rune as well as true rune.

Edit: Edge was there when Viktor fought Neclord? I think not. Unless of course I interpreted your sentence wrong.

anokosa · Post by **anokosa** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:54 am

right, the shield and sword normal runes were born from the TRUE RUNE, beginning's aspects, the Shining Shield Rune and the Black Blade Rune (as Leknaat calls them in Rockaxe). The elemental swords would have been created from the sword runes plus elementals. They could have been somehow fused.

Wraith · Post by **Wraith** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 11:18 am

anokosa wrote:right, the shield and sword normal runes were born from the TRUE RUNE, beginning's aspects, the Shining Shield Rune and the Black Blade Rune (as Leknaat calls them in Rockaxe). The elemental swords would have been created from the sword runes plus elementals. They could have been somehow fused.

The Begining rune never was and thus the two fragments were not actually born from The Begining Rune as you say it.

Futch02 · Post by **Futch02** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 2:45 am

Angelis_Taleria wrote:
Shield rune could be a first tier rune, Bright Shield being a mid-tier rune, and Rune of beginning being the rune that spawns them both, but unlike other cases (True Fire > Rage > Fire) there is only one Mid Tier rune as well as true rune.

The only problem with this analogy is that the Bright Shield is PART of the rune of Beginnings, not a separate rune. The rage rune is a completely different rune from the True Fire.

Angelis_Taleria wrote:Edit: Edge was there when Viktor fought Neclord? I think not. Unless of course I interpreted your sentence wrong.

son_michael was talking about the play based on Neclord's Defeat. If you place Edge as a character in the play, he'll state how "off" the story is, seeming as he most likely heard the story from Viktor. Then again, something tells me Viktor did a little bragging himself, so perhaps poor Edge has no idea what to believe >.<

Wraith · Post by **Wraith** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 7:11 am

The only problem with this analogy is that the Bright Shield is PART of the rune of Beginnings, not a separate rune. The rage rune is a completely different rune from the True Fire.

Wheter the BSR is part of the Rune of the Begining or a sperate rune is subject to opinion rather than facts. We know they both create the RotB but it is commonly accepted as being a seperate 'normal' rune who just happen to create the RotB. Once again this is open to opinion.

anokosa · Post by **anokosa** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 7:38 am

yes i know that this is opinion based, but you can't argue againtst it's logic. The SSR and BBR cannot be normal runes, they have too many powers, like a will of their own and a curse. But the aren't true runes because their power isn't enough for that. And the aspects of Beginning could have spawned the Shield and Sword runes, because looking at their pictures, the colours have been inverted. I'm sorry to offend anyone, but you can't argue with this point.

son_michael · Post by **son_michael** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 9:31 am

there's alot of tricky stuff concerning those runes

we know all true runes have a will and cosciousness of there own but bright shield rune and black sword rune appear to have that as well

To me...bright shield and Black Sword are 2 rune brothers that join together to become a true rune

Suikoden V spoilers in the appropriate thread only please -Op

so using them as examples I come to the conclusion that bright shield and black sword are not true runes until they form together, before they form together there just runes that clash with each other, runes that are stronger than any normal rune and runes with wills of there own

I come to the conclussion that only special runes such as Bright S, Black S,Dawn and Dusk have a will of there own, of course this applies to all true runes as well

demon eye · Post by **demon eye** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 10:25 pm

The question I pose is how can we be sure that ALL runes aren't sentient beings. Sure, we know for certain that True Runes are sentient, but no where is it stated that all runes aren't as they are rarely referred to. So, I wouldn't be too certain that runes in general aren't an entity within themselves. Think about it, a entity spawned from a sentient being is bound to have some sentience within itself, but just may be dormant or overpowered. Obviously, the Bright Shield and Black Sword Runes like the Dusk and Dawn Runes aren't normal runes, but I would not make the fact that they seem to have a will of their own the main reason for them to be considered "special". They are quite "normal" compared to the True Runes as they don't grant agelessness.