Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Hypotheses for, and analyses of, the various Suikoden characters.
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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby KFCrispy » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:30 pm

AteTrack wrote:Has anyone ever brought up why Pesmerga is chasing Yuber?
yes, and the fact that there is absolutely no information regarding this causes the topics to eventually stop because they're full of make-believe.

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby somello405 » Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:59 pm

Perhaps Yuber and Pesmerga are embodiments of the true runes that they possess, and take human forms. So, rather than being humans, they are instead runes. Gods, extra-terrestrials, whatever class of being you want to call them who existed when the Suikoden planet was a baby (or more likely before, helping to create it.)

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby Icegryphon » Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:48 pm

The reason everyone loves the whole Yuber/Pesmerga talks is this.

1) Yuber is mysterious, he's in most of the games, he's extremely evil and powerful, and seems to thrive on chaos...for unknown reasons. That all makes him intriguing.

2) Pesmerga looks REALLY cool and we all like having the ability to play with him.

Because of that we want more of both.
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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby Homac » Thu Apr 02, 2009 3:39 pm

I'm not sure how Yuber and Pesmerga's conflict could really tie in to the main plot too well, but that doesn't stop me from being excited at seeing it reach its climax.

Also, saying someone couldn't be important to the timeline because they're not an automatic recruit is just plain silly, I think it's pretty established that the canon of the series is that in every game all 108 stars are recruited, whether or not that is the player's personal experience with that game.

Also, I took Pesmerga as my third S range character to fight the Golden Hydra every single time I beat Suikoden I.

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby kelvingarinkz » Thu May 14, 2009 9:41 am

i think konami's decision to have pesmerga's and yuber's stars to be different itself is already very telling. there will be a story about the in the future.
for the moment, we know very little of them, so i suppose we just have to wait.

i remember theres a manga showing them fighting, is that a fan-based doujinshi or official manga ?
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bluelightning

Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby bluelightning » Sun Mar 14, 2010 1:48 pm

Those are all good theory's, but this mine.

To me, it seams as though Yuber is a clone or brother of Pesmerga, and if you look at a picture of the two, they look nearly identical, other than hair colour. And the location of where you find Pesmerga(neclords castle and cave of wind) makes me wonder if he has a connection to the star dragon sword. Yuber and Pesmerga could have the same connection to the night rune that the dawn and twilight runes have on the sun rune. Why wouldn't the night rune need the same help that the sun rune needs to stay stable? Why Pesmerga hates Yuber? I'm not sure, but if my theory is correct, then maybe Yuber abandoned the night rune. Which may explain the eightfold rune, since there are 8 phases of the moon. Though this all a long shot theory, I must admit, it still makes sense to me.

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby Alisamakora » Mon Mar 22, 2010 4:59 pm

hmmmm.... i dont know about you, but the whole "dharma and chaos" thing screams sword and shield to me. i know, i know, we have the rune of beginning, but who says the eightfold rune is really a true rune and the source of yubers immortality? and with the rune of beginning, its not really sword and shield themselves.
the 27 true runes are PIECES of sword and shield.
"The 27 gems adorning Sword and Shield
transformed into the 27 True Runes."
includeing the rune of beginning. thus it is not sword and shield themselves. it is still a piece of them. an embodiment, if you will.
in the myth, the brothers became the sky and earth. polar opposites, but both needed to make the world of suikoden.

i dont know about everyone else, but i've always thought the creation myth had major significance (its in every game in some form), and would be brought back into the plot come the end of the series. full circle, you know?
so if yuber and pesmerga's conflict means the end of the series, as they've said, it creates alot of theories.

my theory is thus: yuber and pesmerga have a connection to the creation myth. either they are echos of the brothers battle, or they are warriors who continue to fulfill their will.
its been stated that the sword and shield in the creation myth are embodiments of chaos and order, so why not?

as for a connection to the night rune, thats easy: both sword and shield were born from the "darkness" and created the "stars". in a way the night rune is also an echo of the beginning's darkness.


also? its doesnt help yuber gleefully quoted the creation myth while fighting geddoe in the manga.

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby Zykerion » Mon Mar 22, 2010 8:27 pm

Alisamakora wrote:hmmmm.... i dont know about you, but the whole "dharma and chaos" thing screams sword and shield to me. i know, i know, we have the rune of beginning, but who says the eightfold rune is really a true rune and the source of yubers immortality? and with the rune of beginning, its not really sword and shield themselves.
the 27 true runes are PIECES of sword and shield.
"The 27 gems adorning Sword and Shield
transformed into the 27 True Runes."
includeing the rune of beginning. thus it is not sword and shield themselves. it is still a piece of them. an embodiment, if you will.
in the myth, the brothers became the sky and earth. polar opposites, but both needed to make the world of suikoden.

i dont know about everyone else, but i've always thought the creation myth had major significance (its in every game in some form), and would be brought back into the plot come the end of the series. full circle, you know?
so if yuber and pesmerga's conflict means the end of the series, as they've said, it creates alot of theories.

my theory is thus: yuber and pesmerga have a connection to the creation myth. either they are echos of the brothers battle, or they are warriors who continue to fulfill their will.
its been stated that the sword and shield in the creation myth are embodiments of chaos and order, so why not?

as for a connection to the night rune, thats easy: both sword and shield were born from the "darkness" and created the "stars". in a way the night rune is also an echo of the beginning's darkness.


also? its doesnt help yuber gleefully quoted the creation myth while fighting geddoe in the manga.


Or maybe they :are: the brothers Sword and Shield, still fighting after all this time.

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby Alisamakora » Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:57 pm

maybe, but if that was so, it'd be in spirit only. according to the creation myth they destroyed each other and became the earth and sky.
mind, myths are always bent a little to make it easier for people to handle, but this is a game, not real life. i doubt konami would do something as complex as that.
or maybe they would.
but seriously, yuber makes far to many hints towards such things for me to toss my "sword and shield connection" theory out the window. theres some in the game, if i recall correctly, and even more in the manga. ( he spends about a chapters worth of pages on that stuff, i swear. and geddoe's like "WTF psycho" the whole time)

i hope the next game is announced soon, damnit. im getting a PS3 just in case. ('cause while i like FF, you dont get a console for it. its multiplatform now. 'sides suikoden owns FF any day of the week.)


i also hope the next game is going to take place after 3, or somewhere in the "present" of the suikoden world. because we wont get alot of cameos of past characters if they pull another like 4 again (although i loved it dearly, it lacked any and all cameos. except for dear ted, who was a delight to see. oh, and viki and jeane, but they always show up.)

i wanna see tir again, damnit. T_T and hopefully yuber and pessy boy, but i have a feeling the next game they appear in will be the finale. and i dun want suikoden to end.

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby Wolf Kanno » Tue Feb 07, 2012 5:55 pm

It might be overhyped by fans, I can agree to some point. I honestly don't think their duel will end the series, it is just meant to take place in the final installment so I don't really subscribe to the whole Chaos/Dharma theory that runs rampant among fans. Despite all of this, I do like both characters and would love to actually get more info, that's the real reason why I'm hyped for their final duel, because it will coincide with getting real background info on both characters and tie up one of the series big mysteries.

Man... I wish Konami would get off this "Infinite Worlds" Suikoden Gaiden direction for the series and just finally finish the story of the numbered series. Just give me a Suikoden VI that resolves all the loose ends and will probably take place in Harmonia.
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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby Hirathien » Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:42 pm

Seems like a lot of loose ends to be summed up in a single game, unless the game is massive.

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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby dragons_descent4 » Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:38 am

I was disappointed when Pesmerga wasn't in the third game since Yuber was such a prominent character in it. Although when I first saw Yuber dressed as he was I realized how much I missed the armor on him haha
I also agree with the theory that they're linked to the creation myth as Alisamakora pointed out. It would make a lot of sense, or if they aren't directly connected to it they know more about it than it just being a myth or legend.
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Re: Yuber and Pesmerga - Overhyped

Postby freshmetal » Sun Mar 18, 2012 5:46 pm

Here are my thoughts on the Yuber/Pesmerga side story. I don’t think that their conflict is some order vs. chaos epic world ending battle that will be the end of the series. I think that the original writers simple wanted to extend their conflict to the series’ finale in order to milk their feud in future games. Unfortunately, because the original writer and staff are no longer with Konami, and Konami has no interest in returning to the original Suikoden world, there’s a super high chance that we’ll never see how their conflict resolves.

As for whether their conflict is over-rated, I feel that it is. As others have said, fans tend to flock to “dark and mysterious” characters with “cool looking” armor, so of course fans have hyped up the Yuber/Pesmerga feud despite the fact that the feud has had no real impact on any of the game’s actual stories.

Just for the hell of it, I’ll post my personal theory on just what Yuber and Pesmerga are. BE WARNED, THIS WILL BE AN EPICLY LONG POST, SO PLEASE BEAR WITH ME….

First let’s go over what we DO know about Yuber:
1. Many characters have said that he has an inhuman presence.
2. He has an unnatural level of skill when it comes to both hand to hand combat (S3) and on the battlefield in a cavalry unit (S2).
3. He possesses the Eightfold Rune.
4. He is always “summoned” by other characters for fight for their cause, not his own.
5. He has an uncanny affinity to monsters.
6. He enjoys battle, but always scurries away once the fighting is coming to an end.

What do know about Pesmerga:
1. According to Richmond’s investigations, Pesmerga never eats or sleeps and moves completely silently despite wearing a suit of heavy armor.
2. He does NOT possess any known true rune.
3. He’s pursuing Yuber for unknown reasons.
4. He looks identical to Yuber, but with dark hair.

So here’s my theory…

I believe that Yuber is not from the Suikoden world, but from the World of Emptiness instead. As indicated by other characters, he’s not human at all. To support my theory that Yuber is a “monster” from the world of emptiness is the “Mirage” monster seen in S1, S2, and S3. It’s a monster that was summoned in mass quantities by Windy to fight in the last battle and summoned by Luc in the same fashion in S3. Yuber and Pesmerga’s armor are IDENTICAL to this monster’s armor. Maybe Yuber is some sort of “evolved” mirage.

Yuber was either summoned originally by Windy or crossed worlds on his own somehow. He then came to possess the Eightfold rune. He either came upon it on his own or maybe Windy gave it to him. Perhaps he was summoned simply to host the rune on Windy’s behalf.

The Eightfold Rune is theorized to represent the peaceful path to enlightenment. This completely contradicts everything we know about Yuber. Maybe, since he’s not human, Yuber was able to somehow overpower and suppress the rune’s true desire. As a result, the rune has manifested its true desire and intention in the form of Pesmerga, a “shadow” of its bearer. Pesmerga’s goal is to stop Yuber from further abusing the rune and “enlighten” him with his sword.

That’s my theory. Sadly, because of the state of the Suikoden series, we may never know the true nature of these characters, so fans will have to continue to speculate with wild and sometimes idiotic theories,like I’ve done here.
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