Milich Oppenheimer - The First Narcist

Hypotheses for, and analyses of, the various Suikoden characters.
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Agremsep
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Post by Agremsep »

Narcists are people who love themselves and perhaps mostly things that are beautiful in their view of art. I don't think they are interested in the people of the same sex, but rather acknowledge their beauty. So, I don't think they are gay.

As for Kwanda, I think he's the type that fight on the frontline and willing to his life on the line for the empire. But I have to admit his bulk armour is eye catching.

In fact, I think most of the generals are very devout to the emperor. I think Milich is also a loyal knight as well. Despite his eccentric flavours and interests, he is still devoted to Emperor Barborsa for life.

Perhaps, he blame himself for his inability to save the emperor and empire from corruption and falling, thus, he spends his entire life guarding the tomb.
baron kalan
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Post by baron kalan »

Wasn't Gordon in S3 a narcissit as well?
YouKnowYouGeddoe
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Post by YouKnowYouGeddoe »

Gordon might fit the dictionary definition of "narcissist," but I think that in Suikoden terms he's just a dandy. He doesn't really have that "narcissist" look - no flowers, no bright colors.

Let me put it this way: If he had been in Suikoden 1, he wouldn't have fought in the "Narcissists" team with Milich, Vincent, and Esmeralda. However, he certainly wouldn't have qualified to be in the badass teams like the "Experts," "Invulnerable Defenses," or "Wild Geese." He would probably have been in the "Fops" team.

Along with Iskas.
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patapi
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Post by patapi »

YouKnowYouGeddoe wrote:Let me put it this way: If he had been in Suikoden 1, he wouldn't have fought in the "Narcissists" team with Milich, Vincent, and Esmeralda.
Obviously he wouldn't. The units in S1's strategic battles only accept three characters maximum as unit leaders.

Unless you include Gordon and take one of the other (for example, Vincent), then I'm pretty sure Gordon would fit in just fine. Or Iskas, if you want to have him in the game instead.
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Post by YouKnowYouGeddoe »

It's on.

Let me point out a few features of Gordon's personality and manner that separate him from what I will call the "mainstream" narcissists (as epitomized by Milich, Simone, Vincent, Reinbach, Charlemagne, and Augustine). We will discount Esmeralda for the moment because she is, I believe, the only female narcissist in the Suikoden series.

First, Gordon's attire is not especially "narcissistic." Embroidered vest notwithstanding, he favors muted tones - a far cry from Vincent's vivid red and green or Milich's pastels. Moreover, Gordon does not indulge in the extravagant coiffure that set Charlemagne and Augustine, perhaps the most modestly dressed narcissists, apart. His hair, although probably well-kept, is sensibly styled. Neither in wardrobe nor in grooming does Gordon scream "narcissist."

Second, Gordon's attitude toward women differs markedly from the other narcissists'. From his Suikosource bio:
Ever since his wife divorced him and took custody of their daughter, he relentlessly chases after women that he comes across, in particular Chris Lightfellow. He takes every chance that he gets to ask her to spend time with him.
Two red flags should be going up right off the bat: A. Gordon digs the ladies. The previously established definition of a narcissist hinges on the narcissist's rejection of love for others (except, perhaps, in the courtliest sense of the word) in favor of love for oneself. Behavior like Gordon's is unprecedented among Suikoden narcissists. B. Gordon is a skirt-chaser. Even if he wasn't in love with his ex-wife and isn't particularly in love with Chris, his decidedly unseemly (if not downright unchivalrous) behavior is diametrically opposed to the nobility of purpose championed by Reinbach, for instance.

Third, as far as we know, Gordon has no aristocratic blood. This is an oft-overlooked hallmark of the narcissists, and although it's admittedly not universal (q.v. Augustine, the distinction of whose background is unknown), it's a strong indicator. Gordon seems to be nothing more than a shopkeeper in a country village. At best, he's a narcissist wannabe: He makes noises about "gentlemanliness," but he's clearly not much of an actual gentleman, especially when it comes to women - just ask his old ball and chain.

No one could deny that Gordon exhibits certain "narcissist-like" tendencies. There is confounding evidence - Gordon's appreciation of Augustine's refined qualities, for example. However, as a matter of categorization, I would submit that Gordon diverges in too many ways from the narcissistic form (in Platonic terms) to be a true narcissist. This is why I'd argue that, had he been in the first Suikoden, he wouldn't have had a place beside Milich and Vincent. In fact, Gordon seems to have all the undesirable traits of a narcissist (notably vanity and snobbery) and none of the valuable ones (like a true commitment to defending the honor of the weak).
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Moonbay
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Post by Moonbay »

Gordon reminded me of a Pre-Civil War Southern Gentleman. Concerned with appearance and only associating with the "upper" crust. And the whole "any woman he comes across" should actually be: "any woman of aristocratic standing he comes across." Remember, he wouldn't join you unless you had a group of people with you he felt lived up to his expectations.

Narcissists can appreciate not only their beauty, but the beauty of others: no matter what class they belong in.

Also, it seemed to me that the Narcissists wanted to share themselves with everyone (Look at me! I'm beautiful!), whereas Gordon wanted to share the finer things with only himself and the cream of the crop. His group in Suikoden I would have been "Snobs."
Playing Suikoden III......
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Agremsep
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Post by Agremsep »

Gordon is all about being a fine gentlemen, those you find in UK or the States during the civil war. I don't think he's a narcist, but I think he can make a good conversation with them.
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Post by future_suikoden_writer »

I play s3 first then it get me addicteed...when i play it i hate narcisst alot because its very annoying but funny.then when i play suikoden 1,2&4 i saw their importance..their very unique in dress and in every suikoden characters.gordon too.their all gentlemen and have a taste in fashion and arts especially millich..he the narcisst of all narcisst!!!
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amelia108
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...

Post by amelia108 »

Suikoden V reference deleted

...and i really think konami was pushing it with the whole relationship between simone and vincent in 2. i mean people argue over their sexuality, but there was some definite "innuendo" going on there... if only for comic relief. mind you, i'm not flat out saying they're gay, i'm just saying i think konami intentionally did that to get a cheap laugh.
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Post by Oppenheimer »

Sorry amelia I had to delete a fair bit of your post. But, please don't make any reference to Suikoden V plot information (even vague/general info) yet. Please see the homepage for more information, thanks.
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amelia108
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Post by amelia108 »

sorry! i thought it was only spoilers that weren't allowed... but now that i think about it, i guess they were spoilers... just not very big ones.

just so this post doesnt seem pointless, i'd just like to say that i think narcissists should be the "5" in suikoden 6. i always wanted a party of only narcissists...!

...and now that i think about it i guess this should go in the future suikoden speculation, but... ah i can't win. :P
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Re: Milich Oppenheimer - The First Narcist

Post by anakputa »

I am certain Millich payed a visit in Haud village when he went for the crowning of lymsleia
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