Pesmerga

[Luca Blight]

I think it would have been a cool twist if Yuber and Pesmerga were brothers or related otherwise. Those two designs are so cool. Cannot wait till IV hits the states so I can put another 300+ hours into it.

[Maldonado]

Not that I want to disappoint you, but people who finished Suikoden 3 claim that you should not expect to see Yuber and Pesmerga in Suikoden 4. Sad...

[Ur Rap En]

It will be the hero's of that game who will have to change the destiny of the world by preventing the victory of either Yuber OR pesmerga.

I believe that Archangelknux2 is correct in stating this as before anything there was darkness, darkness is metaphor for the balance and the balance got out of control when sword and sheild, born from the balance began to fight.

If it is true that if Pesmerga wins the battle, Luc's prediction comes true, what is the world like if Yuber won the battle? It could be worse or better, it is unknown how the consequences of the uneven balance could effect the world.

Firstly Hikusaak will be found dead, as his attempt to stop Yuber from causing chaos in Harmonia is futile, Pesmerga who knew that Yuber was opposed to order, asks Hikusaak to hand him over the circle rune, Hikusaak is relectunt, but when Pesmerga tells him he is an incarnation of order and that his destiny was to stop Yuber, he listens to him and we see a flashback of when he used his circle rune to to defeat the kingdom of Armonia, he realises that he had ill used his responsibility of bearing the circle rune, he urges Pesmerga to do all he can to kill Yuber and says that Yuber is waiting for him in his dimension, giving Pesmerga the circle rune and then Pesmerga thanks him and teleports away.

Secondly I believe that there should be a duel between Leknaat and Windy and the winner Leknaat recieves the whole gate rune, Windy appologizes saying that she is sorry that as sisters they became enemies, Leknaat then cries, saying that it was her inability to resist the runes will that led to her evil doings.

Then comes the battle between Yuber and Pesmerga, I believe it should be held in the dimension which Yuber and Pesmerga come from, that by this time Viki has mastered teleporting and teleports the rune bearers to the place of battle in the other dimension to prevent to destruction of not just our world, but her dimension, the world of emptiness, the world of wings and scales... you get the point, every dimension in the suikoverse.

My theory is that all of the rune holders would come together and split into the team for order which fights against the incarnation of chaos (Yuber) and a team for order which fights against the incarnation of order (Pesmerga). I believe that Riou would fight on the team for chaos (due to his rune being bright sheild) and that Jowy would fight on the team for order (due to his rune being black sword), after the battles I believe that Leknaat will say something like in order to keep the balance sustained forever, one of the bearers of the two halves of the rune of begginning must give up their rune (and ultimately their life due to the exhaustion from the battle), Riou being the original Tenkai star decides that his destiny is fulfilled and Jowy recieves the full rune of begginning.

However the rune's own memories remember how Riou changed his fate once before and Jowy's hand glows with the rune of begginning which in turn makes each of the runes for order and chaos begin to glow and fill Riou's body which runic power, both Yuber and Pesmerga disappear and a light shines from where their bodies lay with their runes, the light hovers over Riou and with the power of order and chaos being defeated, the runic power offered merge with the light which hovered over Riou to create the 28th/new 26th true rune... the rune of balance.

Leknaat says that now balance has been achieved, all of the bearers of the 26 remaining true runes must make sure that the balance is not shifted, with Yuber and Pesmerga both dead, she decides that as keeper of the balance to unite all of the nations and of the suikoden world which should each be led by a bearer of one of the 26 true runes, with Riou and Jowy having shared leadership of the strongest power due to their friendhsip and the fact both of their runes together can judge war and maintain the balance.

We then see a flashback of when the true runes were created, after that we see all of the 26 true rune bearers in a summit to declare the world, a world of peace which is free from antogonist, Leknaat says she will use the power of her true gate rune to send any antogonists to the world of emptiness in order to keep the balance of the world.

Then it ends, what do you think of the theory?

[Shirofan]

Extrapolating a theory to a conclusion is a valuable exercise; but what you have done is insert so many extra elements that the original theory is a side issue.

Many of the points you have made are just due to it resulting in a narrative flow you find acceptable; in short the above is a piece of fan-fiction and wholly useless to the topic in hand.

[Ur Rap En]

I get what you mean that it could be conceived as a fan fic, but that is because I have a narrative style of writing, I am so used to writing stories, that when I try and make a theory it ends up sounding like a story, however I disagree with the fact you said it is useless as it declared my own theory of not just the end of the Yuber/Pesmerga feud, but the end of the constant struggle to keep the balance in the Suikoden world, also what differenciates theory from a fact is that fact is 100% verified, my theory in essence is not 100% true but with the hints towards the end of the world in Suikoden 3 from Luc and Leknaat constantly speaking about the balance of the world, as keeper of the balance I believe that Pesmerga would have a role in its ending and that my theory could be possible.

The original idea for the series ending was a duel between Yuber and Pesmerga, and despite the changing in Suikostaff, the ending could be the same and I feel free to theorise over what I believe to be a valid theory as you can not tell me that if both Order and Chaos were defeated, there wouldn't be balance like before darkness shed its tear.

Feel free to explain a thorough reason for why you seem to think my theory is not valid, it still deals with Pesmerga and the ending of the series, which is what many people have hinted at for a long time, you could at least throw up a counter argument instead of just dismissing my point of view, which I find rude, if I am to be told I am incorrect, I would like a valid explanation for why.

[Red Killey]

Your theory is useless because it's not supported by facts. You simply made up about the things such as:
- Hikusaak would be dead (fact: we have no idea about Hikusaak currently)
- Hikusaak giving Circle Rune to Pesmerga (fact: ...err .. never met)
- Pesmerga being an incarnation of order (fact: we have no idea what Pesmerga is)
- Pesmerga being able to teleport (fact: never shown to be able)
- A duel between Leknaat-Windy (fact: Windy is currently Missing)

So yeah, your theory simply has no single fact to back it up at all. Hence, useless as a theory. It's a good story, but unfortunately, has no supporting facts at all.

[Ur Rap En]

Thanks for explaining the reasoning for opposing my theory in a precise manner, my theory was only based on events which are a possibility, they are however not been done is a correct and logical manner. I will try to make my theories more truthful in the future.

[Teni Star]

Maybe Yuber and Pesmerga are results of a magic ritual made by Hikusaak using the Circle Rune that represent the order and stagnation,Pes is order Yuber is stagnation.Hikusaak would wanted to have them to go look for true runes for him/her and when Yuber found one he liked the power and dont gave the rune to Hikusaak and them Hikusaak send Pes to get the rune back.

[Vextor]

I think Pesmerga is simply a disgruntled cheesemaker who is angry at Yuber because he told him that his Muenster cheese smelled like anchovies. Any cheesemaker would be furious over that, enough to chase Yuber around all over the world.

[Rai-Jin]

Yuber alone is very hard to grasp..but if you think about him having a connection to Pesmerga it gets even more complicated because we don't know nothing about him..

I highly doubt Pesmerga is human since he was seen for days never sleeping and eating..I actually think that he is the same being as Yuber is

Perhaps he can only be summoned with Yuber?
But where was he in SIII?

Who knows...I can wait..and to be honest..it's in a way pretty cool they made S4 so side-story like and not continuing after the events of III because my exceptions of V is very very high know and I can't wait to see the first pictures

[Mathiu Silverberg]

It may just be me, but wasn't the Eightfold Rune translated to the Eight-Devil Rune?

In some old literature, there are Eight Circles of Hell, which are all controled by a demon. I get this from the book by Dante Alighieri, "The Inferno." This would also explain a bit about the whole "chaos" trip Yuber is on, and the fact that he is more of a shadow then anything else. It also explain a little about Pesmerga's name; "He Who Chases Death."

Also, order cannot exist without some form of chaos. If Yuber really is a reincarnate form of Chaos, then his death would mean the end of the world. That would make Pesmerga more of a villian then Yuber.

Leknaat, being the "Executor of Balance," must keep things in check. Everything must be equalized, or the world ends. If Yuber really is chaos, then his death would result in the destruction of a Rune; the Circle Rune. It represents order and stagnation, opposite of Yuber.

Have I made reasonable conclusions to this, or am I TOTALLY off?

[Jowy Atreides]

In a couple of places, yes.

The Eightfold Rune hasn't been translated into English yet. The Eight-devil Rune you see in Suikoden Three is simply a lower-tiered version of the Eightfold Rune and is not the Eightfold Rune itself.

In the circumstance that the Eightfold Rune really does get destroyed then it would seem more plausible that instead of the Circle Rune dying along with the Eightfold Rune it would fill the void that the Eightfold Rune left with complete order, absolving chaos as a whole. In my own personal opinion the same would happen with the Moon and Night Runes. If the Moon Rune were to be destroyed it would make sense in my mind that the night would fill in the void in the night left by a missing moon and become more powerful.

[Turin Turambar]

In some old literature, there are Eight Circles of Hell, which are all controled by a demon. I get this from the book by Dante Alighieri, "The Inferno."

According to Dante, there are 9 circles of hell. The ninth circle is held for those guilty of treason. (Pirates of the Carribean has a line that references this ninth circle.) Satan is in the lowest circle (frozen in ice, not burning) chewing on the souls of Judas(betrayed Jesus Christ), Cassius, and Brutus (both betrayed Julius Caesar). Also, demons don't really control hell. Hell is more or less chaotic, with no control whatsoever. However, the punishments were prescribed by God, so if anyone 'controls' hell, it would be God.

So, while it's a great idea to reference the circles of hell, Suikoden most likely did not. For one thing, Dante was Italian, and the people who make Suikoden are Japanese and Chinese, I believe.

But there are some other references in pop culture. I mentioned Pirates of the Carribean. Ghostbusters 2 also references it. The mayor comes in near the end and talks about how he won't let New York descend into the 10th level of hell. Just kinda funny what you notice when you've read a book or two.

<I honestly don't expect anyone to read this, and don't know why I wasted my time in typing it>

[Mathiu Silverberg]

I understand what you mean, Turin. However, Chinese and Japanese mythology and lore isn't the sole backbone of the Suikoden world. It's very mixed with other cultures. It may just be me again, but longswords and broadswords aren't from that particular place in time. Scimitars are a bit aways from the swords used by China and Japan at that time. Clans, like the ones from the Grasslands, are also far different. Even the use of Runes isn't even from that area. It's more likely from Norse or Celtic lore.

I thought that the Nine Circle was the Gate to Purgatory... Must have misunderstood the book.


Jowy, as for the Circle Rune filling the void of the Eightfold Rune's destruction, it couldn't. If the True Runes could so easily fill voids like that, the True Wind Rune could have been destroyed in Suikoden Three without any reprecussions. It states in the game that the Runes are the Gods of that world. If one God dies, everything could be destroyed. Thus, a large part of the plot in Suikoden Three.

[Jowy Atreides]

I didn't say that the destruction of the Eightfold Rune wouldn't cause a big ol' explosion, just that whatever element it controls would be absolved by its opposite (of course, only if the element has an opposite).

Example: if the Eightfold Rune were to be destroyed somehow, it would probably cause an explosion big enough to destroy whatever continent it's on at the moment. The Circle Rune wouldn't reverse this effect, but would rather absorb the 'chaos element' of the Eightfold Rune and absolve chaos as a whole, replacing it with total order. The same could be speculated about the destruction of the True Wind Rune. In theory, if the True Wind Rune is destoryed then the element of 'Wind' no longer exists. No more Air Rune Pieces, Wind Runes, Cyclone Runes, and no wind itself.

As show by Luc in chapter five, the world can exist without chaos. It's a boring place for sure, but it could happen.