The strongest mage to ever usable in suikoden games.

Hypotheses for, and analyses of, the various Suikoden characters.
Snowe Man
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The strongest mage to ever usable in suikoden games.

Postby Snowe Man » Thu Jan 20, 2005 2:46 pm

wasn't it the great crowley himself?

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Giga_Futch
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Postby Giga_Futch » Thu Jan 20, 2005 8:19 pm

I didnt really pay too much attention to stats, but Crowley was pretty good, I remeber that the first time I fought the dragon with the jewels or something around it, he ended up being the last one standing

Matt620
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Postby Matt620 » Thu Jan 20, 2005 8:28 pm

Do you want to look stat wise or plot wise?

Stat wise:

Suiko I had Crowley, Luc, and Tengaar with the highest stats, although, right behind them were: Cleo, Eileen, Hellion, Grenseal, Lotte, McDohl, Milich, Odessa, and Ted.

Suiko II had Luc as the sole highest MGC stat at 08.

07 had Mazus, Jowy, McDohl, and Sigfried. 06 had mages like Sierra, Rina, and Tengaar. 05 had mages like Nina, Riou, and Zamza.

In Suikoden III, the highest MGC stat was tied with Luc and Sarah at 08.

07 MGC was tied between Estella, Joker, Sasarai, and Yuiri, 06 MGC was Lucia, Queen, Rody, both Vikis, Yuber, and Yumi.

The strongest MGC in Suiko IV were characters like Maxine, Ted, Jeane, and Warlock. Slightly lower was Viki, Wendell, Conrad, Sigurd, Katarina, Pablo, and the Hero.

Now, if we're going pure gameplay and including every character, I'm going to say Luc. Although McDohl is an adept magician, he simply doesn't have the advantages of learning from Leknaat. Plus, the True Runes are so powerful, and with Luc's naturally affinity with magic, he puts it to devastating use.

However, if I was going to use non-True Rune characters and going plotwise, I would say:

Suiko I: Crowley. He's simply had much more experience then Tengaar or any of the others. The only soldier type cahracters who have experience using magic in combat settings would be Cleo, Grenseal, Milich, and Odessa. None of them are devoted to magery like Crowley was. Besides, Crowley has infused many runes into his body, more then any of them have.

Suiko II: Mazus. Although I would normally go for Jowy, the Black Sword could technically be counted as a True Rune. Mazus also has much more experience then the others.

Suiko III: Joker. Although Yuiri is a powerful mystic, she is still a young woman, whereas Joker has been using magic for neearly as long as she has been alive. Estella is also a pathological liar, and her claims about beating Crowley are dubious at best.
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Postby Flame Champion » Fri Jan 21, 2005 1:50 am

gameplay should not factor in to this really. most of the powerful magicians get the same stat growth, whoever finishes higher is completely random out of each group (Luc, Mazus etc.). I say this just to get rid of people like Estella, Joker, Jowy, Tengaar, Viki etc. they are all powerful and useful magicians in their own rights, but they dont match up with the real magicians like Leknaat or Crowley.

First off is Crowley. He is undoubtedly one of the best magicians in the suiko world, but he is not in the same echelon as True Rune bearers. It is stated that he wants to achieve the power of a true rune without actually bearing one. By this we can derive that he does not have the power of a true rune bearer, and thus is not the most powerful magician in the world. I'd say that disqualifies Mazus as well, as he is weaker than Crowley if anything.

Windy might be a good bet. She has half a True Rune but more importantly she has been an extremely powerful sorceress for many centuries, and learned many a thing during that time, an advantage she holds over many others. She is able to summon a ridiculous amount of monsters with her half of a true rune, far more than Sarah. However she does bear half a true rune, MEANT for summoning, whereas Sarah is simply a mortal with extreme magical prowess. I'd say Windy is more powerful than Sarah, thanks to her true rune only. If Sarah had one i think she might be the top contender for strongest mage.

As she does not however, i'm going to have to say Luc. Obviously anybody that doesnt bear a true rune can't stand up to him. He is also obviously the superior magician compared to those in Suikoden 3; Hugo, Chris, Geddoe and Sasarai (note that him not being able to get Geddoe's Rune was because their runes have the same power, not them). He also has been trained by Leknaat for many years, and is capable of such advanced techniques such as teleporting, and summoning powerful monsters. In the end, Luc is the best

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jowy blight
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Postby jowy blight » Sat Jan 22, 2005 9:27 am

i think luc is the best he is powerful and he can deafet crowley if he fight him

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Vextor
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Postby Vextor » Sat Jan 22, 2005 9:48 am

Murayama stated that Crowley only used a fraction of his power furing the Gate Rune Wars, so I'll go with Crowley.
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Shirofan
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Postby Shirofan » Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:37 pm

By definition the question asks about which mage is stronger, so you need to compare their abilities with the same runes rather than trying to compare someone with a True Rune to someone without.

If you want a real world metaphor consider motor racing, particularly Formula 1, where you can never be sure whether the winner is a better driver or just has a better car.

Frankly if you take the True Wind Rune away from Luc then he is not in Crowley's league, nor must he be in Mazus' if the latter can compete with Crowley on nearly equal terms.

In terms of ability then Luc would probably rank below Sarah as well as she had more natural talent. Sarah was not at the level of Crowley and Mazus, but mainly that was due to lack of experience; given several decades to hone her abilities, then she might have proven to be more powerful than either of them.

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Postby Turin Turambar » Sat Jan 22, 2005 6:47 pm

I would say Crowley and then Mazus. After all, didn't there huge battle take place before either of them were born?
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Bishop Luc
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Postby Bishop Luc » Sun Jan 30, 2005 3:45 am

Sarah,Luc,Sasarai Sarah chants Flowing rune very fast, Luc chants TWR very fast, Sasarai chants TER very fast
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Postby Culqan » Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:38 am

I think the Luc is best without Wizard or that kind of runes..
Well.. In Suikoden2 he is the best but i dont know about others..
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Postby Usesnumbers » Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:17 pm

Luc hasn't brought himself back to life yet as crowley or mazus has, so I would think perhaps they hold power no one understands.
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The Black Knight
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Postby The Black Knight » Wed Feb 02, 2005 10:12 pm

Ted is the best i think from suikoden 4 he uses that soul eater pretty well.
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Postby Fists Of Protocol » Wed Feb 02, 2005 10:56 pm

I'm just happy Luc isn't as strong against you in 3 as he was for you in 2.

He took down Luca Blight and the Beast Rune pretty much by himself. He sucked in 1 tho.

and yeah, Ted was awesome in 4...both in physical and magic attacks...funny how badly he sucked in the short time you could use him in 1.

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Postby Dura Sinai » Thu Feb 03, 2005 7:56 am

Fists Of Protocol wrote:I'm just happy Luc isn't as strong against you in 3 as he was for you in 2.

He took down Luca Blight and the Beast Rune pretty much by himself. He sucked in 1 tho.

and yeah, Ted was awesome in 4...both in physical and magic attacks...funny how badly he sucked in the short time you could use him in 1.



Um.... Luc is still pretty damn powerful although Sera is even moreso in this case. And he was overpowered massively in both the previous two games. Basically though in the first game swap his wind funr for a cyclone or thunder rune and he takes down bosses sickeningly easy.




As far as Ted in Suikoden 1..... you play with him next to Tir who is quite possibly the most overpowered person in any of the games. And just about any character at level 3 is going to not be so good.

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Blackhand jr
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Postby Blackhand jr » Fri Feb 04, 2005 3:23 am

I'm gonna say Crowley. I mean didn't ne of his fights change an entire landscape? Plus can you imange how powerfull he would be if he had a true rune?


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