Roy - Nadir theory

Hypotheses for, and analyses of, the various Suikoden characters.
RevKoden
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Roy - Nadir theory

Postby RevKoden » Tue Aug 14, 2012 10:27 am

It can actually become true...the bad thing is,it's that Guillaume and Nadir stars is actually switched..If you see Nadir star..it is connected for the "appraiser" category star...while Guillaume star is connected to that of the "bandit" category star...besides guillaume is a freaking appraiser in S3, why must he became a thief he already give up at least during S3..but the problem might relies as in with Peck of SUikoden 4...he isnt named in S4 but he is named in S tactics...so possibly the base for Nadir as roy hasnt begun yet..and during the time of suikoden v...the idea of roy becoming actor is come...

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Sasarai10
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Sasarai10 » Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:20 pm

Note that Tomo from S2,and the 3 large monsters from S2 (Feather,Abizboah,Sigfried) can have 2 different stars of destiny. And the stars of them can be switched. For example if you recruit Sigfried first,he is the Tenman Star,and if you recruit Feather after Sigfried,he will be the Tentai Star,and vice versa. So yes,their stars must actually be switched,and the theory that Roy and Nadir is the same person,is true.

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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Antimatzist » Fri Aug 17, 2012 3:26 pm

@Sasarai: Wrong. For as we know, someone cannot change his SoD just like that. In your examples, the stars don't change, they are set in the minute you recruit the person. There is no switching of SoDs involved. Valeria/Kasumi is a good example for that, since they keep their Star from the previous game.

So I'd say no, this is a theory with no back-up. EVen though they are somewhat leading to that with Roy, Faylen and Faylon being an actor group of three people, and Nadir is supposed to having been in a three-man-group in the past. Maybe they wanted to hint to this, but didn't think through it thoroughly enough.

@RevKoden: What is with Peck!?

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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby JanusThePaladin » Fri Aug 17, 2012 4:00 pm

Antimatzist wrote:@Sasarai: Wrong. For as we know, someone cannot change his SoD just like that. In your examples, the stars don't change, they are set in the minute you recruit the person. There is no switching of SoDs involved. Valeria/Kasumi is a good example for that, since they keep their Star from the previous game.


not true. Little Viki and big Viki do not share a star

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Hirathien
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Hirathien » Fri Aug 17, 2012 5:58 pm

JanusThePaladin wrote:
Antimatzist wrote:@Sasarai: Wrong. For as we know, someone cannot change his SoD just like that. In your examples, the stars don't change, they are set in the minute you recruit the person. There is no switching of SoDs involved. Valeria/Kasumi is a good example for that, since they keep their Star from the previous game.


not true. Little Viki and big Viki do not share a star


That's a really weird example, they are two split individuals, since they both exist in the same game and can be on the screen at the same time.

Not saying Young Viki and Viki ain't the same person, but for the purpose of the SoD thing, they aren't.

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Sasarai10
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Sasarai10 » Fri Aug 17, 2012 6:36 pm

Antimatzist wrote:@Sasarai: Wrong. For as we know, someone cannot change his SoD just like that. In your examples, the stars don't change, they are set in the minute you recruit the person. There is no switching of SoDs involved. Valeria/Kasumi is a good example for that, since they keep their Star from the previous game.

So I'd say no, this is a theory with no back-up. EVen though they are somewhat leading to that with Roy, Faylen and Faylon being an actor group of three people, and Nadir is supposed to having been in a three-man-group in the past. Maybe they wanted to hint to this, but didn't think through it thoroughly enough.

@RevKoden: What is with Peck!?



I wonder why you cannot recruit both Valeria and Kasumi. That realy destroys the tablet of stars IMO,because Tomo hasn't an official star,and takes the star of the rejected one.

Another thing that will make the tablet of stars more "completed" is,that large monsters shouldn't be SoD. Although i wonder why Rulodia was a non-star,and the other 3 were...totally strange.


Then in that case we will have one star left (Tenman or Tentai) who could be another character of the game. Let's say that Tomo takes Tentai,so we have left the Tenman star...possible characters of taking this star would be Rowd,Solon,Gorudo,Culgan or Seed. Or Boris,if he could be recruitable in another way,withoout sacrificing Ridley.

Too bad they didn't make the tablet like this... :(

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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby JanusThePaladin » Fri Aug 17, 2012 7:58 pm

that always bugged me about Suikoden 2. Didnt Fukien state in Suikoden 1 that your star was the star that was highest in the heavens or some such upon your birth? Then how could certain characters switch stars?

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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Antimatzist » Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:45 pm

The thing is that they don't explain it in the games, because in the game's reality, the switching of stars didn't happen. It's only because we know that it could have been different, that we are thinking about it.
I think that was also (mor or less) Konamis explanation for it, in the game you play, the stars are like you decide them and not different, but it can change with every game you play. And as long as the monsters and Tomo won't return as playable characters to the Suikodens eries, they really don't need to care (and learned their lesson after II).

@monsters: I think it was just bad design. They should have made it:
Way A: Recruit Siegfried, Feather and Ayda
Way B: Recruit Abizboah, Rulodia and Chuchara
And all of them are SoDs. That way, you don't miss the 108 stars.

@Viki: I guess we will never know what happened there. We don't know if they are the same person or different iterations from alternate dimensions or whatever.

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Sasarai10
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Sasarai10 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:25 am

Antimatzist wrote:
@monsters: I think it was just bad design. They should have made it:
Way A: Recruit Siegfried, Feather and Ayda
Way B: Recruit Abizboah, Rulodia and Chuchara
And all of them are SoDs. That way, you don't miss the 108 stars.




Correct...another mistake is,that you must have castle level 4 in order to get Rulodia. That means you must recruit Kasumi instead of Valeria,because you won't have enough recruits to get castle level 4,with Valeria.

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Roshambeaux
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Roshambeaux » Sun Feb 01, 2015 5:26 pm

After investigating Nadir for a third time, Kidd will say this: "He was a traveling entertainer. It was a three-man company, but it broke up. Now he's a drama producer." I think it's more likely that Roy was a part of the 3 man acting company along with Nadir and Gordon. There's no information regarding that third person, but the most reasonable conclusion I can come up with is Roy filling in that third spot, since his ending says that he travels up north to join an acting troupe after some grueling training.
A raw tomato for the win!

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Sasarai10
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Sasarai10 » Fri Jun 19, 2015 6:08 pm

Roshambeaux wrote:After investigating Nadir for a third time, Kidd will say this: "He was a traveling entertainer. It was a three-man company, but it broke up. Now he's a drama producer." I think it's more likely that Roy was a part of the 3 man acting company along with Nadir and Gordon. There's no information regarding that third person, but the most reasonable conclusion I can come up with is Roy filling in that third spot, since his ending says that he travels up north to join an acting troupe after some grueling training.


That makes sense,since Roy and Nadir share different SoDs

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sticky-runes
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby sticky-runes » Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:16 am

Roy's death is cannon. End of.

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Sasarai10
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Sasarai10 » Sat Jun 20, 2015 11:08 am

sticky-runes wrote:Roy's death is cannon. End of.


I think this is just an alternative. Roy's being alive at the end of the game's canon if i remember well....

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sticky-runes
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby sticky-runes » Sun Jun 21, 2015 2:57 am

No. Roy dies.

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Sasarai10
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Re: Roy - Nadir theory

Postby Sasarai10 » Sun Jun 21, 2015 12:25 pm

sticky-runes wrote:No. Roy dies.


Any proof about it?


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