How would you build up stats for future playable characters?

Hypotheses for, and analyses of, the various Suikoden characters.
User avatar
ninjaluc79
Posts: 845
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:45 pm
Location: The Island Nations
Contact:

How would you build up stats for future playable characters?

Postby ninjaluc79 » Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:03 am

Hi everyone.

I have been aware of attempts to create fan games based on Suikoverse events not featured in the official games, such as the Succession Wars involving Barbarossa Rugner.

As you know, Barbarossa had the Sovereign Rune on his Dragon King Sword in Suikoden 1. We also know that *Sovereign has anti-magic properties.

So, given the chance, how would you build Barbarossa's stats, assuming:

a He had *Sovereign before and during the war
b. He only got *Sovereign AFTER the war

For option A, since *Sovereign nullifies all magic directed against its wielder, Barbarossa would most likely be a Tank. Which makes me wonder what kind of party you would get if you have a Tank for a hero. Since in this case Barbie cannot use any magic with *Sovereign, a low MAG value for him would still suit him all right.

For option B, if you're going to replicate S1's game engine, 04 is the lowest MAG rank you can get for a Tenkai if he gets a spell-type True Rune (such as Soul Eater and Bright Shield), since you only need to have 100 MAG to have enough MP (1st level 4 MP before level 50 at the most) to use the level 4 spell AFTER it unlocks.

And even if Barbie (nice name) doesn't get a TR, he still needs a decent MAG stat so he could become a true Jack of All Trades like a traditional Suikoden hero. Nevertheless, I would still like Barbie to be either a Tank or a Mighty Glacier.

What are your opinions on this?
It's not all about knowledge, but it helps.

User avatar
patapi
Forum Moderator
Posts: 2515
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 3:55 pm

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby patapi » Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:23 am

Going by what we have seen in the games thus far, I wonder how they would implement the ability to invoke the spells off runes embedded on a character's weapon. i.e. You can't actually the spells from weapon runes in Suikoden II nor III.

But I suppose anything can be changed to cater to players' demands.

Like how the Chronicle of Endless Travels served as Tierkreis' proxy for Gate-Blinking family of runes, perhaps the Sovereign Rune would be similar to the Scribes' Tatau Council? That is, unless one considers these resemblances as corruptions instead.

Ellyos
Posts: 129
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2009 1:19 pm
Location: France

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby Ellyos » Tue Jan 03, 2012 4:14 pm

ninjaluc79 wrote:a He had *Sovereign before and during the war

For option A, since *Sovereign nullifies all magic directed against its wielder, Barbarossa would most likely be a Tank. Which makes me wonder what kind of party you would get if you have a Tank for a hero. Since in this case Barbie cannot use any magic with *Sovereign, a low MAG value for him would still suit him all right.

A tank could be nice, but not a tank like Nova in Tierkreis where the role is to defend and play with counter-attack.
I disagree the fact he doesn't need Magic value. Sovereign Rune nullifies magic but it let him become a golden hydra. What I mean is MP could be used for other technics than Magic Spells. Moreover, maybe nullifying magic needs to have a strong mastery in the Rune.
Anyway, Barbarossa doesn't need high Speed value, neither an high Magic Defense. After all, he's strong against magic power with his sword. As tank, Defense and Skill should be high. Attack power can be average, like Luck (which could even be low). HP have to be strong.
A team using a tank hero... Well, main allies (frequently in team) can be fragile members to protect. If Windy is in your plan, that's a good example.

b. He only got *Sovereign AFTER the war

For option B, if you're going to replicate S1's game engine, 04 is the lowest MAG rank you can get for a Tenkai if he gets a spell-type True Rune (such as Soul Eater and Bright Shield), since you only need to have 100 MAG to have enough MP (1st level 4 MP before level 50 at the most) to use the level 4 spell AFTER it unlocks.

For me, option A or B are finally not different. About the 100 MAG threshold, it's all about the level you plan to reach by the end of the game, without leveling session.
Anyway, a factotum as hero is the easy choice but not always the best one. Giving a strong role to the hero can also be valuable.
I mean, a tank at low level doesn't need to have healing capacity. Medicine and other healing items are enough. Magic can be used by support allies.
Sure, you must not create too many stars with the same role because hero will already fill it. But, even like this, if you plan to control team without hero in it, that's not so a problem.

User avatar
ninjaluc79
Posts: 845
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:45 pm
Location: The Island Nations
Contact:

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby ninjaluc79 » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:27 pm

Well, I based the 100 MAG threshold on the fact that the lowest MAG rank among the TR-bearing heroes so far is good enough for them to be able to use the unlockable level 4 spell by the time it is unlocked, usually during the late game.

Because you know, if you still don't have any level 4 MP by the time your level 4 spell is unlocked, you have to wait till the FINAL BOSS before you can use it. Or hell, EVEN AFTER THAT. That is the problem with the 03 MAG rank under the traditional Suikoden battle engine, since it can reach 100 MAG at level 55 at best, 60+ at the worst. You would have to think real hard of a plot device that allows the hero to have his level 4 spell unlocked AFTER level 55.

The Flame Champion comes into mind. It is possible to unlock Hellfire during the events of the final battle between the Fire Bringer and Harmonia as the hero would be about Level 58 by that time. We know that the FC lost control of the True Fire Rune during that battle, resulting in massive casualties from both sides. Too bad the Fire Runes have a friendly-fire feature. :,( Any ideas about the final dungeon in FC's story?

@topic Of course we can still make *Sovereign spell-based, and I would like to see how spells from Weapon runes would be implemented. If that's the case, then the 100 MAG threshold still holds, and the level 4 spell turns Barbarossa into a Golden Hydra.

Next, how would you build Teo McDohl, Kilawher Shulen, and Windy?
It's not all about knowledge, but it helps.

JanusThePaladin
Posts: 710
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 2:02 am
Location: Under your bed, planning your intricate death...
Contact:

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby JanusThePaladin » Sat Aug 11, 2012 5:19 pm

ninjaluc79 wrote:Well, I based the 100 MAG threshold on the fact that the lowest MAG rank among the TR-bearing heroes so far is good enough for them to be able to use the unlockable level 4 spell by the time it is unlocked, usually during the late game.


That's not necessarily true. With Chris and the True Water Rune in S3 I never got her level 4 spell

User avatar
ninjaluc79
Posts: 845
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:45 pm
Location: The Island Nations
Contact:

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby ninjaluc79 » Fri Dec 21, 2012 12:24 pm

Except that Chris is not the true hero of S3, but Hugo.
It's not all about knowledge, but it helps.

User avatar
freshmetal
Posts: 360
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 2:21 pm
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby freshmetal » Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:14 pm

ninjaluc79 wrote:Except that Chris is not the true hero of S3, but Hugo.

Technically Hugo isn't the "true hero" of S3, Thomas is. After all Thomas is the Tenkai star. Hugo is only the Tensyo star, shared by the likes of Valeria and Zegai.
PSN: FreshMetal80

User avatar
ninjaluc79
Posts: 845
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:45 pm
Location: The Island Nations
Contact:

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby ninjaluc79 » Sat Dec 22, 2012 12:21 am

freshmetal wrote:
ninjaluc79 wrote:Except that Chris is not the true hero of S3, but Hugo.

Technically Hugo isn't the "true hero" of S3, Thomas is. After all Thomas is the Tenkai star. Hugo is only the Tensyo star, shared by the likes of Valeria and Zegai.


Thomas, alright. The Tenkai star with the lowest MAG stat rank (02 MAG), but still has a very high affinity to the Wind element.

For comparison:

Tir McDohl - 06 MAG - no affinities in S1, high affinity to Darkness and Water elements in S2.
Riou - 05 MAG - high Resurrection/Holy element affinity
Lazlo - 05 MAG - high Water element affinity
Freyjadour - 05 MAG - high Sun/Holy elemental affinity

As you can see, most Tenkai stars have above-average talent in magic and wield blunt weapons, with the exceptions of Thomas and Lazlo, who wield swords.
It's not all about knowledge, but it helps.

User avatar
wataru14
Guide Writer
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2010 10:37 am
Location: Long Island, New York

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby wataru14 » Sun Feb 17, 2013 1:03 am

Frey's MGC growth is officially 05? Is there a stat growth chart for S5? There isn't one in the Gameplay Guides section.

User avatar
ninjaluc79
Posts: 845
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:45 pm
Location: The Island Nations
Contact:

Re: How would you build up stats for future playable charact

Postby ninjaluc79 » Sat Apr 20, 2013 2:18 am

There isn't. I just based it by comparing S5 stats to those of the rest of the series.

S5 base stats are roughly twice the base stats of the rest.
It's not all about knowledge, but it helps.


Return to “Character Theories”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests