dwarves role in suikoden

pesmerga786 · Post by **pesmerga786** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 4:53 pm

Did anyone else feel that the dwarves should have had a bigger role in suikoden, there werent even any recruitable dwarves. They could have at least had some recruitable character and removed another useless character. Dont get me started on the ducks lol. I actually liked some of the ducks, but im just hoping they dont keep adding a new race to each game. I also think the elves should have a bigger role. Like more roles for simone in suikoden 3 and the elves in suikoden 4.

Jowy Atreides · Post by **Jowy Atreides** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 5:09 pm

Twaikin has been a recruitable dwarf, and he was in Suikoden III. Your hopes of not having a new race in each game should've been crushed long ago, seeing as Konami always introduces a new race in each game. I don't quite understand your word choice when it comes to Simone, either.

Anyway, onto my opinion of the dwarves' role in Suikoden. In all honesty, Konami really let me down with the dwarves. I wouldn't say I exactly had my hopes up about having more dwarves, but the only ones we know of aren't very substantial. The chief of the Dwarf Village, Dowango, Kiba's assistant and Twaikin are very insubstantial characters in the scope of things. Dowango would be a badass character to have on your team, but it'll probably never happen (he could be the blacksmith, for example). Kiba's assistant seems to be pretty badass as well, but we're not even sure if he's a dwarf or not. I doubt we'll be seeing any dwarves in Suikoden V either. I mean, the dwarf in Suikoden III was a stretch as it is (digging from Toran seems like laziness on Konami's part for his reasoning on being in the Great Hollow).

son_michael · Post by **son_michael** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 5:12 pm

I think they should have made tenkai stars out of different races{not just humans}, then we could see kingdoms and armies of that race. If konami were to do this then I believe we could learn about races naturally without having to focus all our attention on them, obviously if the hero is a dog then we will lern more about the dog people, so in that sense it would be cool if konami made other races the center of the wars and the tenkais, but at the same time im not suggestiing that every other game is like this, just every now and then we could see a game with a different race as the main focus and the tenkai wouldnt have to be human. I think it would be a preety cool idea, and of course even if they did do that, I would still want them to introduce a new race every game

Red Killey · Post by **Red Killey** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 5:57 pm

I personally am not the biggest dwarves fan, so I don't mind the minimal role they have so far. And in a sense, I think it fits the dwarves mindset for them to have very minimal role in Suikoden games. In Suikoden I, they were portrayed as a really arrogant race. They really looked down on humans and only believed that humans could do something when their vault was broken into by Tir and co.

While Elves were also portrayed in the same too, they made characters like Kirkis (also Paula and Selma) who believed in humans. So it'd make sense for Elves to appear more often than dwarves.

Personally though, I think Konami just thought that Elves sell more games than Dwarves because of the target market. Elves are meant to be tall, cool, pretty or whatever. Dwarves are portrayed as ugly, short, rude, etc. Just look at the number of fans in Lord of the Rings, then compare Legolas fans with Gimli's. You'll see what I mean.

As for the idea of having a non-human Tenkai Star, I don't think it'd work. Not to sound racist, but I believe that humans are the majority in Suikoden World, and Tenkai Star was supposed to gather the other SoDs. It wouldn't really make sense for someone from a minority race (say elves, dwarves, kobolds, etc) to actually gather the other races.

Jowy Atreides · Post by **Jowy Atreides** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:33 pm

Judging from the translated trailer, it seems as though dwarves will play a role again, if only a small one.

pesmerga786 · Post by **pesmerga786** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:02 am

Jowy Atreides wrote:Twaikin has been a recruitable dwarf, and he was in Suikoden III. Your hopes of not having a new race in each game should've been crushed long ago, seeing as Konami always introduces a new race in each game. I don't quite understand your word choice when it comes to Simone, either.

Anyway, onto my opinion of the dwarves' role in Suikoden. In all honesty, Konami really let me down with the dwarves. I wouldn't say I exactly had my hopes up about having more dwarves, but the only ones we know of aren't very substantial. The chief of the Dwarf Village, Dowango, Kiba's assistant and Twaikin are very insubstantial characters in the scope of things. Dowango would be a badass character to have on your team, but it'll probably never happen (he could be the blacksmith, for example). Kiba's assistant seems to be pretty badass as well, but we're not even sure if he's a dwarf or not. I doubt we'll be seeing any dwarves in Suikoden V either. I mean, the dwarf in Suikoden III was a stretch as it is (digging from Toran seems like laziness on Konami's part for his reasoning on being in the Great Hollow).

Twaikan was a dwarf, I thought he was like half man/mole.

Black Knight Yuber · Post by **Black Knight Yuber** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:09 am

Nope, he was a digging dwarf who supposedly dug a hole all the way to Toran. His origin is Dwarven Village south of Grasslands.

Chris_Lightfellow · Post by **Chris_Lightfellow** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:47 pm

pesmerga786 wrote:
Jowy Atreides wrote:Twaikin has been a recruitable dwarf, and he was in Suikoden III. Your hopes of not having a new race in each game should've been crushed long ago, seeing as Konami always introduces a new race in each game. I don't quite understand your word choice when it comes to Simone, either.

Anyway, onto my opinion of the dwarves' role in Suikoden. In all honesty, Konami really let me down with the dwarves. I wouldn't say I exactly had my hopes up about having more dwarves, but the only ones we know of aren't very substantial. The chief of the Dwarf Village, Dowango, Kiba's assistant and Twaikin are very insubstantial characters in the scope of things. Dowango would be a badass character to have on your team, but it'll probably never happen (he could be the blacksmith, for example). Kiba's assistant seems to be pretty badass as well, but we're not even sure if he's a dwarf or not. I doubt we'll be seeing any dwarves in Suikoden V either. I mean, the dwarf in Suikoden III was a stretch as it is (digging from Toran seems like laziness on Konami's part for his reasoning on being in the Great Hollow).
Twaikan was a dwarf, I thought he was like half man/mole.

The lizard who yelled at Twaikin called him a moleman to which Twaikin responded "I prefer to be called dwarf" or something like that.

Faust · Post by **Faust** » Wed Sep 21, 2005 11:18 am

Personally though, I think Konami just thought that Elves sell more games than Dwarves because of the target market. Elves are meant to be tall, cool, pretty or whatever. Dwarves are portrayed as ugly, short, rude, etc. Just look at the number of fans in Lord of the Rings, then compare Legolas fans with Gimli's. You'll see what I mean.

I totally agree. As a fan of the dwarfs, I don't mind the minimal role they've had in the series so far to avoid flogging a dead horse. I was pleasantly surprised by Twakain in SuikoIII, and the fact that he's an optional star to recruit is very nice. However, Elves do seem more popular in the world of (I want to say "pussies", but say it without offense. One of my nearest and dearest is a "pussy" hehe, but real men like Dwarfs!) teenage gamers and fantasy-book-buyers, so this is probably why Elves are thrust on us as non-optional stars in three of the four genso games we've had so far. (I like Stallion in SuikoII as he was an...optional...elf?!)

As for the idea of having a non-human Tenkai Star, I don't think it'd work. Not to sound racist, but I believe that humans are the majority in Suikoden World, and Tenkai Star was supposed to gather the other SoDs. It wouldn't really make sense for someone from a minority race (say elves, dwarves, kobolds, etc) to actually gather the other races

Also agreed. It wouldn't make much sense, and as a human being we possibly couldn't empathise with a non-human Tenkai. Evidence: The Nay-Kobold near the Baths in Nay who states something like "You humans worry about all sorts of things. Try taking it easy once in a while!". Different species have different outlooks to things. (This is not to say I wouldn't welcome a Middle-Eastern-style, Native-American-style or Sub-Saharan-style Tenkai).

pesmerga786 · Post by **pesmerga786** » Wed Sep 21, 2005 1:34 pm

Faust wrote:
Personally though, I think Konami just thought that Elves sell more games than Dwarves because of the target market. Elves are meant to be tall, cool, pretty or whatever. Dwarves are portrayed as ugly, short, rude, etc. Just look at the number of fans in Lord of the Rings, then compare Legolas fans with Gimli's. You'll see what I mean.
I totally agree. As a fan of the dwarfs, I don't mind the minimal role they've had in the series so far to avoid flogging a dead horse. I was pleasantly surprised by Twakain in SuikoIII, and the fact that he's an optional star to recruit is very nice. However, Elves do seem more popular in the world of (I want to say "pussies", but say it without offense. One of my nearest and dearest is a "pussy" hehe, but real men like Dwarfs!) teenage gamers and fantasy-book-buyers, so this is probably why Elves are thrust on us as non-optional stars in three of the four genso games we've had so far. (I like Stallion in SuikoII as he was an...optional...elf?!)

As for the idea of having a non-human Tenkai Star, I don't think it'd work. Not to sound racist, but I believe that humans are the majority in Suikoden World, and Tenkai Star was supposed to gather the other SoDs. It wouldn't really make sense for someone from a minority race (say elves, dwarves, kobolds, etc) to actually gather the other races
Also agreed. It wouldn't make much sense, and as a human being we possibly couldn't empathise with a non-human Tenkai. Evidence: The Nay-Kobold near the Baths in Nay who states something like "You humans worry about all sorts of things. Try taking it easy once in a while!". Different species have different outlooks to things. (This is not to say I wouldn't welcome a Middle-Eastern-style, Native-American-style or Sub-Saharan-style Tenkai).

hmm
nice feed back, enjoyed reading it
I just wanted to say
Twaikan was extremely powerful and had high hp
I wonder if there would be any future dward SoDs and they probably will also be strong, Twaikan was just a digger, if a dwarf warrior joined he would be reallly strong
what are women dwarves called
same thing?

Stan · Post by **Stan** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:49 pm

I think they should have made the darves, elves,lizards,ducks, and kolbolds have a bigger role and should put them in more of the suikoden games. But they should leave out the Nay-kolbolds they were just annoying and had no point in the game. The elves in Suikoden 4 had very little plot line and you couldn't even go in they're village which sucked big time (at least in Suikoden 1 you went into there village once).

pesmerga786 · Post by **pesmerga786** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 7:28 pm

Stan wrote:I think they should have made the darves, elves,lizards,ducks, and kolbolds have a bigger role and should put them in more of the suikoden games. But they should leave out the Nay-kolbolds they were just annoying and had no point in the game. The elves in Suikoden 4 had very little plot line and you couldn't even go in they're village which sucked big time (at least in Suikoden 1 you went into there village once).

Yeah, I was really mad that they didn't let us. All we saw was some old elf and stuff and that is it. I was hoping to explore the city

Chris_Lightfellow · Post by **Chris_Lightfellow** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 9:36 pm

pesmerga786 wrote:
Stan wrote:I think they should have made the darves, elves,lizards,ducks, and kolbolds have a bigger role and should put them in more of the suikoden games. But they should leave out the Nay-kolbolds they were just annoying and had no point in the game. The elves in Suikoden 4 had very little plot line and you couldn't even go in they're village which sucked big time (at least in Suikoden 1 you went into there village once).
Yeah, I was really mad that they didn't let us. All we saw was some old elf and stuff and that is it. I was hoping to explore the city

What really made me mad was that the door to the rest of the village was there, but there was a barrier or something on it so you couldn't go through.

pesmerga786 · Post by **pesmerga786** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:06 am

Chris_Lightfellow wrote:
pesmerga786 wrote:
Stan wrote:I think they should have made the darves, elves,lizards,ducks, and kolbolds have a bigger role and should put them in more of the suikoden games. But they should leave out the Nay-kolbolds they were just annoying and had no point in the game. The elves in Suikoden 4 had very little plot line and you couldn't even go in they're village which sucked big time (at least in Suikoden 1 you went into there village once).
Yeah, I was really mad that they didn't let us. All we saw was some old elf and stuff and that is it. I was hoping to explore the city
What really made me mad was that the door to the rest of the village was there, but there was a barrier or something on it so you couldn't go through.

Oh my god
That is what I was mad about. I was like
that is a mean trick. Oh well. I hope Suikoden 5 is much better

SuikoCrimson108 · Post by **SuikoCrimson108** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:09 am

I love the dwarves' culture they are known for their advance inventions and great craftsmanship. I think I saw a dwarf in the Suikoden 5 thriller but Im not really sure if he is. The old man with hat and staff sure looks like a dwarf to me.